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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 413652 |
Time | |
Date | 199809 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : lax airport : lax |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 3000 msl bound upper : 3800 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : lax tower : lax |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Brasilia EMB-120 All Series |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | climbout : initial cruise other |
Route In Use | departure other enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B737 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | cruise other landing : go around |
Route In Use | arrival other enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 2200 flight time type : 200 |
ASRS Report | 413652 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | controller : approach flight crew : captain |
Qualification | other other : other pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : atp pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 4700 flight time type : 1400 |
ASRS Report | 413889 |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : required legal separation non adherence : clearance non adherence other other spatial deviation other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance flight crew : took evasive action other |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 1500 vertical : 250 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error |
Narrative:
As we departed runway 24L at lax, an air carrier Y jet declared a go around on runway 24R. They were given a heading of 270 degrees and we were told to offset to the left. We were then told to maintain 2000 ft and contact departure on 125.2. Departure told us to climb to 3000 ft and expect to be vectored under the air carrier Y which we had in sight. After air carrier Y climbed above our altitude, we were given a vector of 360 degrees under them. I commented to the captain we could not stay on this heading long because of terrain. As we approached the higher terrain, a heading was issued, but there was confusion on the frequency as to who it was to. Neither the captain nor I remembered hearing a vector for us, but suspected it was for us. For at least 1 min, the frequency was useless with socal approach control, air carrier Y jet and others blocking each other. About the same time I was getting nervous about terrain, we got a TCASII traffic alert. Off our left side we both spotted a smaller GA aircraft (aircraft Z) at our altitude. Unable to turn left because of traffic, right because air carrier Y was somewhere over there and now turning our way because we figured out he or she took our vector. I initiated a climb to avoid terrain. I climbed to 3800 ft. Socal noticed our altitude deviation and instructed us to descend to 3000 ft. The captain informed the controller we had climbed due to terrain, were clear of it and could now descend back to 3000 ft. The air carrier Y jet was now back in sight. We got another TCASII alert, but never saw additional traffic. I think it might have been air carrier Y, but am not sure. This whole situation could have been avoided if the controller would have taken control of the frequency and asked everybody to 'stand by,' then issued specific instructions. Air carrier Y also should have listened more carefully when they took the wrong call. They blocked the frequency at least 3 times asking what heading to fly when socal approach control was trying to straighten things out. Supplemental information from acn 413889: my first officer climbed to 3800 ft, and I was unable to notify our situation with ATC due to high frequency congestion. Air carrier Y had a similar sounding call sign. We later found out that the MVA for our area was 3900 ft.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: TRACON DEP CTLR BECOMES INVOLVED IN A SYS ERROR WITH AN E120 ON AN IFR DEP, AN ACR B737 ON A MISSED APCH, AND A TRANSITING BE35, MOST LIKELY VFR. THE E120 WAS TOLD TO EXPECT VECTOR UNDER AND AROUND THE B737. THE B737 TOOK THE E120'S VECTORS. THE E120 INITIATED EVASIVE MSAW ACTION DUE TO APCHING TERRAIN, AND RECEIVED A TCASII ALERT WITH THE BE35 DURING THE MSAW MANEUVER.
Narrative: AS WE DEPARTED RWY 24L AT LAX, AN ACR Y JET DECLARED A GAR ON RWY 24R. THEY WERE GIVEN A HDG OF 270 DEGS AND WE WERE TOLD TO OFFSET TO THE L. WE WERE THEN TOLD TO MAINTAIN 2000 FT AND CONTACT DEP ON 125.2. DEP TOLD US TO CLB TO 3000 FT AND EXPECT TO BE VECTORED UNDER THE ACR Y WHICH WE HAD IN SIGHT. AFTER ACR Y CLBED ABOVE OUR ALT, WE WERE GIVEN A VECTOR OF 360 DEGS UNDER THEM. I COMMENTED TO THE CAPT WE COULD NOT STAY ON THIS HDG LONG BECAUSE OF TERRAIN. AS WE APCHED THE HIGHER TERRAIN, A HDG WAS ISSUED, BUT THERE WAS CONFUSION ON THE FREQ AS TO WHO IT WAS TO. NEITHER THE CAPT NOR I REMEMBERED HEARING A VECTOR FOR US, BUT SUSPECTED IT WAS FOR US. FOR AT LEAST 1 MIN, THE FREQ WAS USELESS WITH SOCAL APCH CTL, ACR Y JET AND OTHERS BLOCKING EACH OTHER. ABOUT THE SAME TIME I WAS GETTING NERVOUS ABOUT TERRAIN, WE GOT A TCASII TFC ALERT. OFF OUR L SIDE WE BOTH SPOTTED A SMALLER GA ACFT (ACFT Z) AT OUR ALT. UNABLE TO TURN L BECAUSE OF TFC, R BECAUSE ACR Y WAS SOMEWHERE OVER THERE AND NOW TURNING OUR WAY BECAUSE WE FIGURED OUT HE OR SHE TOOK OUR VECTOR. I INITIATED A CLB TO AVOID TERRAIN. I CLBED TO 3800 FT. SOCAL NOTICED OUR ALTDEV AND INSTRUCTED US TO DSND TO 3000 FT. THE CAPT INFORMED THE CTLR WE HAD CLBED DUE TO TERRAIN, WERE CLR OF IT AND COULD NOW DSND BACK TO 3000 FT. THE ACR Y JET WAS NOW BACK IN SIGHT. WE GOT ANOTHER TCASII ALERT, BUT NEVER SAW ADDITIONAL TFC. I THINK IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN ACR Y, BUT AM NOT SURE. THIS WHOLE SIT COULD HAVE BEEN AVOIDED IF THE CTLR WOULD HAVE TAKEN CTL OF THE FREQ AND ASKED EVERYBODY TO 'STAND BY,' THEN ISSUED SPECIFIC INSTRUCTIONS. ACR Y ALSO SHOULD HAVE LISTENED MORE CAREFULLY WHEN THEY TOOK THE WRONG CALL. THEY BLOCKED THE FREQ AT LEAST 3 TIMES ASKING WHAT HDG TO FLY WHEN SOCAL APCH CTL WAS TRYING TO STRAIGHTEN THINGS OUT. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 413889: MY FO CLBED TO 3800 FT, AND I WAS UNABLE TO NOTIFY OUR SIT WITH ATC DUE TO HIGH FREQ CONGESTION. ACR Y HAD A SIMILAR SOUNDING CALL SIGN. WE LATER FOUND OUT THAT THE MVA FOR OUR AREA WAS 3900 FT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.