37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 416480 |
Time | |
Date | 199810 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : aid |
State Reference | IN |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 2500 msl bound upper : 2500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zid |
Operator | general aviation : personal |
Make Model Name | Small Aircraft, High Wing, 1 Eng, Fixed Gear |
Flight Phase | cruise other |
Route In Use | enroute : direct |
Flight Plan | None |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | Other |
Function | flight crew : single pilot |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : commercial |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 11 flight time total : 1226 flight time type : 33 |
ASRS Report | 416480 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | government : faa |
Function | controller : radar |
Qualification | controller : radar |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Situations | |
Publication | Unspecified |
Narrative:
I was on a VFR flight from bmi to osu. My route of flight was from VOR to VOR, bmi-dnv-mie-rod direct osu, using LORAN to verify and back-up. My cruising altitude was 2500 ft MSL. After takeoff the WX remained VFR and 2500 ft MSL gave adequate separation. Approximately 25 NM west of mie, I contacted ZID, as that was the listed radar facility for both muncie and anderson, in. I was given a transponder code and subsequently told that I was in radar contact. Shortly thereafter, I advised the ZID controller that I was going to make a 180 degree turn, and I wanted to contact flight watch for a WX update. The ZID controller said 'ok,' and that if I decided to continue to recontact him. Ind flight watch advised that muncie was reporting 1400 ft ceiling, 7 mi visibility, but that conditions a little south of my intended course were much better. I then commenced a 180 degree turn back to the west and recontacted ZID. The same controller responded and asked if I had decided what I wanted to do. I replied that I would like to deviate a few mi to the south to clear the muncie WX if that would be ok, then continue on to rod VOR when able. The controller replied, 'ok, remain VFR.' a few mins later the controller called and said that I was now in aid airspace and that they had a C172 taking off. I asked if he wanted me to contact anderson tower and he said 'no,' that he had told them I was there. I then altered my course back to the west and advised the controller that I had cleared the marginal WX and wanted to continue on to rod, to which he replied acceptance. Approaching rod, ZID advised that radar service was terminated and I should squawk VFR. I continued on to osu obtaining flight following from both dayton and columbus with no problems. The problem that arose regarding my flight was quite disturbing to me to say the least. Since I knew that both muncie and anderson were class D airspace, and that I would be passing over muncie on the planned course, I believed it not only prudent but wise from a safety aspect to contact the controling radar facility in advance to announce my intentions. Thus, I believed that I was not only getting TA's but also complying with ATC. I therefore believed that once in radar contact with the controling facility I would be advised if or when I needed to contact another facility. I now do not believe this to be the case based upon the way I was advised that I was in someone else's airspace. Perhaps I put too much faith in the system, or maybe I could have asked for more assistance in the form of vectors but I believed at the time I was complying with the needs of safety. All through the yrs, all of my training has always suggested that if you were talking to someone you would be doing what was supposed to be done. Once, I even had one ATC controller tell me, rather sternly, that when you are talking to an ATC facility they will make the necessary notifications unless advised otherwise. I, of course, assumed that that always applied, but if it does not then I am quite sure that there are others who may fall into the same trap. I have always believed that the safest thing to do is to contact someone and let them know you are there and what is happening. If pilots begin to feel that they are going to be crucified because they cannot out guess the system, then unfortunately some will try to circumvent it with fatal results. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following information: the reporter stated that he was previously told that the controller was responsible for coordinating his transit through other airspace, but that his fellow pilots told him that it was his responsibility. Also, when he checked with pilot group, they told him it was his responsibility. The aim does not specifically address airspace transition while under radar advisories.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: C206 PLT CONFUSED AS TO HIS RESPONSIBILITIES WHILE UNDER TA'S IN ZID AIRSPACE.
Narrative: I WAS ON A VFR FLT FROM BMI TO OSU. MY RTE OF FLT WAS FROM VOR TO VOR, BMI-DNV-MIE-ROD DIRECT OSU, USING LORAN TO VERIFY AND BACK-UP. MY CRUISING ALT WAS 2500 FT MSL. AFTER TKOF THE WX REMAINED VFR AND 2500 FT MSL GAVE ADEQUATE SEPARATION. APPROX 25 NM W OF MIE, I CONTACTED ZID, AS THAT WAS THE LISTED RADAR FACILITY FOR BOTH MUNCIE AND ANDERSON, IN. I WAS GIVEN A XPONDER CODE AND SUBSEQUENTLY TOLD THAT I WAS IN RADAR CONTACT. SHORTLY THEREAFTER, I ADVISED THE ZID CTLR THAT I WAS GOING TO MAKE A 180 DEG TURN, AND I WANTED TO CONTACT FLT WATCH FOR A WX UPDATE. THE ZID CTLR SAID 'OK,' AND THAT IF I DECIDED TO CONTINUE TO RECONTACT HIM. IND FLT WATCH ADVISED THAT MUNCIE WAS RPTING 1400 FT CEILING, 7 MI VISIBILITY, BUT THAT CONDITIONS A LITTLE S OF MY INTENDED COURSE WERE MUCH BETTER. I THEN COMMENCED A 180 DEG TURN BACK TO THE W AND RECONTACTED ZID. THE SAME CTLR RESPONDED AND ASKED IF I HAD DECIDED WHAT I WANTED TO DO. I REPLIED THAT I WOULD LIKE TO DEVIATE A FEW MI TO THE S TO CLR THE MUNCIE WX IF THAT WOULD BE OK, THEN CONTINUE ON TO ROD VOR WHEN ABLE. THE CTLR REPLIED, 'OK, REMAIN VFR.' A FEW MINS LATER THE CTLR CALLED AND SAID THAT I WAS NOW IN AID AIRSPACE AND THAT THEY HAD A C172 TAKING OFF. I ASKED IF HE WANTED ME TO CONTACT ANDERSON TWR AND HE SAID 'NO,' THAT HE HAD TOLD THEM I WAS THERE. I THEN ALTERED MY COURSE BACK TO THE W AND ADVISED THE CTLR THAT I HAD CLRED THE MARGINAL WX AND WANTED TO CONTINUE ON TO ROD, TO WHICH HE REPLIED ACCEPTANCE. APCHING ROD, ZID ADVISED THAT RADAR SVC WAS TERMINATED AND I SHOULD SQUAWK VFR. I CONTINUED ON TO OSU OBTAINING FLT FOLLOWING FROM BOTH DAYTON AND COLUMBUS WITH NO PROBS. THE PROB THAT AROSE REGARDING MY FLT WAS QUITE DISTURBING TO ME TO SAY THE LEAST. SINCE I KNEW THAT BOTH MUNCIE AND ANDERSON WERE CLASS D AIRSPACE, AND THAT I WOULD BE PASSING OVER MUNCIE ON THE PLANNED COURSE, I BELIEVED IT NOT ONLY PRUDENT BUT WISE FROM A SAFETY ASPECT TO CONTACT THE CTLING RADAR FACILITY IN ADVANCE TO ANNOUNCE MY INTENTIONS. THUS, I BELIEVED THAT I WAS NOT ONLY GETTING TA'S BUT ALSO COMPLYING WITH ATC. I THEREFORE BELIEVED THAT ONCE IN RADAR CONTACT WITH THE CTLING FACILITY I WOULD BE ADVISED IF OR WHEN I NEEDED TO CONTACT ANOTHER FACILITY. I NOW DO NOT BELIEVE THIS TO BE THE CASE BASED UPON THE WAY I WAS ADVISED THAT I WAS IN SOMEONE ELSE'S AIRSPACE. PERHAPS I PUT TOO MUCH FAITH IN THE SYS, OR MAYBE I COULD HAVE ASKED FOR MORE ASSISTANCE IN THE FORM OF VECTORS BUT I BELIEVED AT THE TIME I WAS COMPLYING WITH THE NEEDS OF SAFETY. ALL THROUGH THE YRS, ALL OF MY TRAINING HAS ALWAYS SUGGESTED THAT IF YOU WERE TALKING TO SOMEONE YOU WOULD BE DOING WHAT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE DONE. ONCE, I EVEN HAD ONE ATC CTLR TELL ME, RATHER STERNLY, THAT WHEN YOU ARE TALKING TO AN ATC FACILITY THEY WILL MAKE THE NECESSARY NOTIFICATIONS UNLESS ADVISED OTHERWISE. I, OF COURSE, ASSUMED THAT THAT ALWAYS APPLIED, BUT IF IT DOES NOT THEN I AM QUITE SURE THAT THERE ARE OTHERS WHO MAY FALL INTO THE SAME TRAP. I HAVE ALWAYS BELIEVED THAT THE SAFEST THING TO DO IS TO CONTACT SOMEONE AND LET THEM KNOW YOU ARE THERE AND WHAT IS HAPPENING. IF PLTS BEGIN TO FEEL THAT THEY ARE GOING TO BE CRUCIFIED BECAUSE THEY CANNOT OUT GUESS THE SYS, THEN UNFORTUNATELY SOME WILL TRY TO CIRCUMVENT IT WITH FATAL RESULTS. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: THE RPTR STATED THAT HE WAS PREVIOUSLY TOLD THAT THE CTLR WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR COORDINATING HIS TRANSIT THROUGH OTHER AIRSPACE, BUT THAT HIS FELLOW PLTS TOLD HIM THAT IT WAS HIS RESPONSIBILITY. ALSO, WHEN HE CHKED WITH PLT GROUP, THEY TOLD HIM IT WAS HIS RESPONSIBILITY. THE AIM DOES NOT SPECIFICALLY ADDRESS AIRSPACE TRANSITION WHILE UNDER RADAR ADVISORIES.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.