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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 435345 |
Time | |
Date | 199904 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : sus.airport |
State Reference | MO |
Altitude | msl single value : 6000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Mixed |
Weather Elements | Thunderstorm |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : t75.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : charter |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 135 |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | arrival : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : charter |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 5000 flight time type : 150 |
ASRS Report | 435345 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : charter |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | inflight encounter : weather non adherence : far non adherence : published procedure |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa other flight crewb |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance flight crew : exited adverse environment flight crew : took precautionary avoidance action |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Narrative:
Stl approach tried to get us to take vector into level 5 thunderstorm. While making wbound descent into destination field (sus) we painted severe WX on radar and confirmed same WX visually. Radar showed large cells over st louis county moving slowly wnw with level 5 thunderstorm in our flight path 20 mi ahead. Captain asked stl approach for deviation to southwest. Approach said he couldn't give us deviation. Captain queried approach again about deviation and request was again declined by approach. Approach told us to maintain 270 degree heading (right into cell). Captain again asked for 210 degree heading and approach stopped answering his calls. We continued on heading up to within 1 or 2 mi of cells when captain got a 170 degree heading by approach away from cell. After a couple of mins while flying on a southerly heading, approach offered to take us north, that he had a plan to take us around the WX. It soon became evident from the conversation between the captain, controller and another aircraft ahead that the controller was going to have us follow another aircraft through the cell. The captain declined this plan. The controller got agitated with this and shortly thereafter we were handed off to another frequency and a different controller who descended us to 3000 ft MSL and routed southwest under the approach arrival corridor for lambert field. After getting on the ground I called approach facility on telephone and talked to supervisor about the situation. He was sympathetic to our plight. He put me on the phone with the second controller who helped us out in the end. He explained that first controller was new and didn't have much experience with that type of situation.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: APCH CTLR REFUSES TO COOPERATE WITH FLC REGARDING WX AVOIDANCE.
Narrative: STL APCH TRIED TO GET US TO TAKE VECTOR INTO LEVEL 5 TSTM. WHILE MAKING WBOUND DSCNT INTO DEST FIELD (SUS) WE PAINTED SEVERE WX ON RADAR AND CONFIRMED SAME WX VISUALLY. RADAR SHOWED LARGE CELLS OVER ST LOUIS COUNTY MOVING SLOWLY WNW WITH LEVEL 5 TSTM IN OUR FLT PATH 20 MI AHEAD. CAPT ASKED STL APCH FOR DEV TO SW. APCH SAID HE COULDN'T GIVE US DEV. CAPT QUERIED APCH AGAIN ABOUT DEV AND REQUEST WAS AGAIN DECLINED BY APCH. APCH TOLD US TO MAINTAIN 270 DEG HDG (RIGHT INTO CELL). CAPT AGAIN ASKED FOR 210 DEG HDG AND APCH STOPPED ANSWERING HIS CALLS. WE CONTINUED ON HDG UP TO WITHIN 1 OR 2 MI OF CELLS WHEN CAPT GOT A 170 DEG HDG BY APCH AWAY FROM CELL. AFTER A COUPLE OF MINS WHILE FLYING ON A SOUTHERLY HDG, APCH OFFERED TO TAKE US N, THAT HE HAD A PLAN TO TAKE US AROUND THE WX. IT SOON BECAME EVIDENT FROM THE CONVERSATION BTWN THE CAPT, CTLR AND ANOTHER ACFT AHEAD THAT THE CTLR WAS GOING TO HAVE US FOLLOW ANOTHER ACFT THROUGH THE CELL. THE CAPT DECLINED THIS PLAN. THE CTLR GOT AGITATED WITH THIS AND SHORTLY THEREAFTER WE WERE HANDED OFF TO ANOTHER FREQ AND A DIFFERENT CTLR WHO DSNDED US TO 3000 FT MSL AND ROUTED SW UNDER THE APCH ARR CORRIDOR FOR LAMBERT FIELD. AFTER GETTING ON THE GND I CALLED APCH FACILITY ON TELEPHONE AND TALKED TO SUPVR ABOUT THE SIT. HE WAS SYMPATHETIC TO OUR PLIGHT. HE PUT ME ON THE PHONE WITH THE SECOND CTLR WHO HELPED US OUT IN THE END. HE EXPLAINED THAT FIRST CTLR WAS NEW AND DIDN'T HAVE MUCH EXPERIENCE WITH THAT TYPE OF SIT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.