37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 567339 |
Time | |
Date | 200212 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : teb.airport |
State Reference | NJ |
Altitude | msl single value : 1500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : teb.tower |
Operator | general aviation : corporate |
Make Model Name | Challenger CL604 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Navigation In Use | other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | approach : instrument precision |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : corporate |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 75 flight time total : 14000 flight time type : 300 |
ASRS Report | 567339 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : corporate |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : crossing restriction not met non adherence : clearance non adherence : published procedure |
Independent Detector | other controllerb |
Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Chart Or Publication Flight Crew Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
On approach to teterboro, nj, we were given a TA for traffic at 1900 ft, and were told we could decrease our descent. After clearing the traffic, we leveled at 2000 ft with new york approach. At that time we briefed the visual approach to runway 1 as the winds were 330 degrees at 18 KTS gusting to 28 KTS, and our aircraft has a 24 KT crosswind limit. Our clearance was then changed to the ILS runway 6 approach, and we were told that the winds were now 330 degrees at 12 KTS. This was acceptable as it was within aircraft limitations. We stayed at 2000 ft and elected to intercept the GS from that altitude, as is common practice. When descending through 1700 ft, teterboro tower called us and said that we missed the 1500 ft mandatory altitude at dandy, a fix on the runway 6 approach. We assumed that clearance for the approach deleted the altitude restr. With all the traffic in the new york area, and the air crews trying to keep visual separation as well as radar separation, it would be better if new york approach would bring you down to 1500 ft to avoid the possible confusion at dandy. I have made many ILS approachs, and don't recall any mandatory altitude. While departing teterboro the next day, the radar controller made a comment to another aircraft about reading the fine print on the SID. With all the traffic in the new york area, I don't think there should be any fine print. We should try to get rid of those traps.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: THE MANDATORY ALT BTWN VINGS AND DANDY ON THE ILS RWY 6 TO TETERBORO, NJ, IS MISSED BY A CPR PLT WHO HELD HIS LAST ASSIGNED ALT UNTIL GS INTERCEPT AFTER BEING CLRED FOR THE APCH.
Narrative: ON APCH TO TETERBORO, NJ, WE WERE GIVEN A TA FOR TFC AT 1900 FT, AND WERE TOLD WE COULD DECREASE OUR DSCNT. AFTER CLRING THE TFC, WE LEVELED AT 2000 FT WITH NEW YORK APCH. AT THAT TIME WE BRIEFED THE VISUAL APCH TO RWY 1 AS THE WINDS WERE 330 DEGS AT 18 KTS GUSTING TO 28 KTS, AND OUR ACFT HAS A 24 KT XWIND LIMIT. OUR CLRNC WAS THEN CHANGED TO THE ILS RWY 6 APCH, AND WE WERE TOLD THAT THE WINDS WERE NOW 330 DEGS AT 12 KTS. THIS WAS ACCEPTABLE AS IT WAS WITHIN ACFT LIMITATIONS. WE STAYED AT 2000 FT AND ELECTED TO INTERCEPT THE GS FROM THAT ALT, AS IS COMMON PRACTICE. WHEN DSNDING THROUGH 1700 FT, TETERBORO TWR CALLED US AND SAID THAT WE MISSED THE 1500 FT MANDATORY ALT AT DANDY, A FIX ON THE RWY 6 APCH. WE ASSUMED THAT CLRNC FOR THE APCH DELETED THE ALT RESTR. WITH ALL THE TFC IN THE NEW YORK AREA, AND THE AIR CREWS TRYING TO KEEP VISUAL SEPARATION AS WELL AS RADAR SEPARATION, IT WOULD BE BETTER IF NEW YORK APCH WOULD BRING YOU DOWN TO 1500 FT TO AVOID THE POSSIBLE CONFUSION AT DANDY. I HAVE MADE MANY ILS APCHS, AND DON'T RECALL ANY MANDATORY ALT. WHILE DEPARTING TETERBORO THE NEXT DAY, THE RADAR CTLR MADE A COMMENT TO ANOTHER ACFT ABOUT READING THE FINE PRINT ON THE SID. WITH ALL THE TFC IN THE NEW YORK AREA, I DON'T THINK THERE SHOULD BE ANY FINE PRINT. WE SHOULD TRY TO GET RID OF THOSE TRAPS.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.