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AA5 instructor and student request IFR clearance return to departure point as WX deteriorates, but have a 'concern' that an IFR was initially issued.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 573120 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200302 |
| Day | Thu |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | intersection : kemke |
| State Reference | OH |
| Altitude | msl single value : 3000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : cle.tracon |
| Operator | general aviation : instructional |
| Make Model Name | Cheetah, Tiger, Traveler |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Flight Phase | cruise : level descent : approach |
| Route In Use | arrival : on vectors enroute : on vectors |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | other |
| Function | flight crew : single pilot instruction : instructor oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : commercial pilot : instrument pilot : multi engine |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 640 flight time type : 425 |
| ASRS Report | 573120 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | other |
| Function | flight crew : single pilot instruction : trainee |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | inflight encounter : weather other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance other |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | Weather ATC Human Performance Flight Crew Human Performance |
| Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Narrative:
On an instrument training flight, my student and I flew from 1g5 (medina) to lpr (lorain) to practice approachs and holds. On the return flight, I told my student to call cle on 125.35 and ask if we could transition their airspace. They cleared us into class B and gave us a squawk code. They told us to proceed on course. The visibility in our direction was still VFR, but deteriorating. I thought it would be a good opportunity to show my student how to get an IFR clearance. I called cle and requested a pop-up clearance to 1g5 and the VOR 27 approach. Cle gave us a vector and told us to climb to 3000 ft MSL. Cle set us up for the approach and when we were established, told us 'frequency change approved squawk VFR.' (conditions at this time were MVFR.) my student replied 'we are in IMC.' I then took over and told ATC that I tried to obtain a pop-up clearance and wanted to stay with them. ATC cleared us for the approach and I canceled on the ground. There was some confusion about whether or not we had received a clearance. We were at no time in IMC, my student has only been in actual once and is not used to MVFR. Cleveland was working another plane off 1g5 in VMC.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: AA5 INSTRUCTOR AND STUDENT REQUEST IFR CLRNC RETURN TO DEP POINT AS WX DETERIORATES, BUT HAVE A 'CONCERN' THAT AN IFR WAS INITIALLY ISSUED.
Narrative: ON AN INST TRAINING FLT, MY STUDENT AND I FLEW FROM 1G5 (MEDINA) TO LPR (LORAIN) TO PRACTICE APCHS AND HOLDS. ON THE RETURN FLT, I TOLD MY STUDENT TO CALL CLE ON 125.35 AND ASK IF WE COULD TRANSITION THEIR AIRSPACE. THEY CLRED US INTO CLASS B AND GAVE US A SQUAWK CODE. THEY TOLD US TO PROCEED ON COURSE. THE VISIBILITY IN OUR DIRECTION WAS STILL VFR, BUT DETERIORATING. I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE A GOOD OPPORTUNITY TO SHOW MY STUDENT HOW TO GET AN IFR CLRNC. I CALLED CLE AND REQUESTED A POP-UP CLRNC TO 1G5 AND THE VOR 27 APCH. CLE GAVE US A VECTOR AND TOLD US TO CLB TO 3000 FT MSL. CLE SET US UP FOR THE APCH AND WHEN WE WERE ESTABLISHED, TOLD US 'FREQ CHANGE APPROVED SQUAWK VFR.' (CONDITIONS AT THIS TIME WERE MVFR.) MY STUDENT REPLIED 'WE ARE IN IMC.' I THEN TOOK OVER AND TOLD ATC THAT I TRIED TO OBTAIN A POP-UP CLRNC AND WANTED TO STAY WITH THEM. ATC CLRED US FOR THE APCH AND I CANCELED ON THE GND. THERE WAS SOME CONFUSION ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT WE HAD RECEIVED A CLRNC. WE WERE AT NO TIME IN IMC, MY STUDENT HAS ONLY BEEN IN ACTUAL ONCE AND IS NOT USED TO MVFR. CLEVELAND WAS WORKING ANOTHER PLANE OFF 1G5 IN VMC.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.