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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 624360 |
Time | |
Date | 200407 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : elp.airport |
State Reference | TX |
Altitude | agl single value : 0 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B737-300 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | ground : taxi |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 8700 flight time type : 2700 |
ASRS Report | 624360 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 240 flight time total : 12000 flight time type : 6500 |
ASRS Report | 624912 |
Events | |
Anomaly | incursion : runway non adherence : far non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Aircraft Flight Crew Human Performance Airport |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Aircraft was loaded to just 100 pounds (119443) under ATOG (119.5). Discussed takeoff and chose bleeds off on opc. Stopping margin was 1198 ft. Thought we would use intersection G to increase takeoff roll distance. After pushback, we turned right towards intersection F, but it is a one direction taxiway (sbound only), so we continued turning to the right and entered the next intersection just prior to the threshold of runway 8R. The entire time, we were on ground control frequency. At this point we realized we had entered the extended area of runway 8R without clearance. We came to a stop and asked ground what to do. They said to contact tower. We contacted tower and asked if we could back taxi to intersection G. We got permission to back taxi to intersection G and then were cleared for takeoff. Until this point, neither ground or tower said anything about our incursion. After an uneventful takeoff and before switching to departure, I asked tower if we should call someone when we land. The controller said, 'no, but don't do that again.' I acknowledged that with a thank you and changed frequency. I believe the factors were the following: close to ATOG and a bleeds off takeoff that left us with only 1198 ft and a desire to use more runway. The close proximity of the gate to the runway which has some very confusing intxns and one-way traffic rules. The right turn the captain made which made it more difficult for him to clear himself in the turn. I don't fly into elp very often but I've learned my lesson that the txwys there are confusing. Although we really didn't rush since we were on time, the totality of the circumstances slowed our thinking and threw us off, causing us to stray onto the runway. Supplemental information from acn 624912: since I had already started the right turn out of parking (runway 8 is behind me), we had to continue that right turn the long way around and I am looking for the signs for taxiway G. All my attention is focused out the left side of the aircraft. I finally saw the black taxiway sign for taxiway G and started taxiing towards it. Very shortly thereafter, I glanced to the right and was immediately sickened to see the runway markings for runway 8. With my attention focused outward instead of down, I never saw a hold short line. I stopped the aircraft and discussed the situation with the first officer. Silence from the ground controller. Elp is a confusing setup. The ground controller should have said 'taxi to runway 8, contact tower' because you are already right there, there is no taxiway G from that location.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: RWY INCURSION BY A B737-300 WHEN CREW IS CONCERNED WITH A NEAR MAX WT TKOF PROC AND THE RWY LENGTH AVAILABLE FOR TKOF AT ELP.
Narrative: ACFT WAS LOADED TO JUST 100 LBS (119443) UNDER ATOG (119.5). DISCUSSED TKOF AND CHOSE BLEEDS OFF ON OPC. STOPPING MARGIN WAS 1198 FT. THOUGHT WE WOULD USE INTXN G TO INCREASE TKOF ROLL DISTANCE. AFTER PUSHBACK, WE TURNED R TOWARDS INTXN F, BUT IT IS A ONE DIRECTION TXWY (SBOUND ONLY), SO WE CONTINUED TURNING TO THE R AND ENTERED THE NEXT INTXN JUST PRIOR TO THE THRESHOLD OF RWY 8R. THE ENTIRE TIME, WE WERE ON GND CTL FREQ. AT THIS POINT WE REALIZED WE HAD ENTERED THE EXTENDED AREA OF RWY 8R WITHOUT CLRNC. WE CAME TO A STOP AND ASKED GND WHAT TO DO. THEY SAID TO CONTACT TWR. WE CONTACTED TWR AND ASKED IF WE COULD BACK TAXI TO INTXN G. WE GOT PERMISSION TO BACK TAXI TO INTXN G AND THEN WERE CLRED FOR TKOF. UNTIL THIS POINT, NEITHER GND OR TWR SAID ANYTHING ABOUT OUR INCURSION. AFTER AN UNEVENTFUL TKOF AND BEFORE SWITCHING TO DEP, I ASKED TWR IF WE SHOULD CALL SOMEONE WHEN WE LAND. THE CTLR SAID, 'NO, BUT DON'T DO THAT AGAIN.' I ACKNOWLEDGED THAT WITH A THANK YOU AND CHANGED FREQ. I BELIEVE THE FACTORS WERE THE FOLLOWING: CLOSE TO ATOG AND A BLEEDS OFF TKOF THAT LEFT US WITH ONLY 1198 FT AND A DESIRE TO USE MORE RWY. THE CLOSE PROX OF THE GATE TO THE RWY WHICH HAS SOME VERY CONFUSING INTXNS AND ONE-WAY TFC RULES. THE R TURN THE CAPT MADE WHICH MADE IT MORE DIFFICULT FOR HIM TO CLR HIMSELF IN THE TURN. I DON'T FLY INTO ELP VERY OFTEN BUT I'VE LEARNED MY LESSON THAT THE TXWYS THERE ARE CONFUSING. ALTHOUGH WE REALLY DIDN'T RUSH SINCE WE WERE ON TIME, THE TOTALITY OF THE CIRCUMSTANCES SLOWED OUR THINKING AND THREW US OFF, CAUSING US TO STRAY ONTO THE RWY. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 624912: SINCE I HAD ALREADY STARTED THE R TURN OUT OF PARKING (RWY 8 IS BEHIND ME), WE HAD TO CONTINUE THAT R TURN THE LONG WAY AROUND AND I AM LOOKING FOR THE SIGNS FOR TXWY G. ALL MY ATTN IS FOCUSED OUT THE L SIDE OF THE ACFT. I FINALLY SAW THE BLACK TXWY SIGN FOR TXWY G AND STARTED TAXIING TOWARDS IT. VERY SHORTLY THEREAFTER, I GLANCED TO THE R AND WAS IMMEDIATELY SICKENED TO SEE THE RWY MARKINGS FOR RWY 8. WITH MY ATTN FOCUSED OUTWARD INSTEAD OF DOWN, I NEVER SAW A HOLD SHORT LINE. I STOPPED THE ACFT AND DISCUSSED THE SIT WITH THE FO. SILENCE FROM THE GND CTLR. ELP IS A CONFUSING SETUP. THE GND CTLR SHOULD HAVE SAID 'TAXI TO RWY 8, CONTACT TWR' BECAUSE YOU ARE ALREADY RIGHT THERE, THERE IS NO TXWY G FROM THAT LOCATION.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.