37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 727500 |
Time | |
Date | 200702 |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : ord.airport |
State Reference | IL |
Altitude | msl single value : 4600 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : c90.tracon tower : roc.tower |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | EMB ERJ 170/175 ER&LR |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | ils localizer & glide slope : 27r other other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | arrival : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 120 flight time total : 2000 flight time type : 1120 |
ASRS Report | 727500 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 229 flight time total : 2000 flight time type : 1296 |
ASRS Report | 727501 |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : clearance other anomaly |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Flight Crew Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
Narrative:
When approaching ord; we were assigned runway 22R. When checking on with a second controller; we were confirmed runway 22R again. A few minutes later; we were changed to runway 27R. We were then given a 060 degree heading after ord VOR. At approximately 10000 ft MSL; ATC said; 'as soon as you get slowed down; descend and maintain 7000 ft.' shortly after we were cleared to 4000 ft; expecting a short approach. When given a 210 degree heading to turn back toward final; ATC asked what our speed was. First officer stated; '250 KTS.' ATC then said; 'you were given 210 KTS. Tighten your turn.' we increased our bank angle. ATC then said; 'stop descent. Do you see company traffic on final for runway 27L at 12 O'clock?' we then reported traffic in sight and were cleared for visual runway 27R. We were never given 210 KTS; and if we were; it was never acknowledged by readback and ATC never noticed. We are certain 210 KTS wasn't ever assigned and if it was; why didn't ATC catch it sooner and let us descend 6000 ft at 250 KTS? Only one FMS (first officer's) was working which further increased our workload after 2 runway assignments in just a few minutes. Its possible 210 was assigned but never acknowledged due to an overwhelming amount of reassignments; vectors; briefings; and checklists. ATC should've better planned our approach and not pressured us into such a tight turn near parallel traffic. Its clear they were having lots of traffic issues and placed their burden on us at last minute. If they don't hear 210 KTS read back; they should demand it. It's impossible to slow to a speed you never acknowledged.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ERJ-170 FLT CREW HAS A SPD DEV DURING ARR TO ORD FOLLOWING A LATE RWY CHANGE.
Narrative: WHEN APPROACHING ORD; WE WERE ASSIGNED RWY 22R. WHEN CHKING ON WITH A SECOND CTLR; WE WERE CONFIRMED RWY 22R AGAIN. A FEW MINUTES LATER; WE WERE CHANGED TO RWY 27R. WE WERE THEN GIVEN A 060 DEG HDG AFTER ORD VOR. AT APPROX 10000 FT MSL; ATC SAID; 'AS SOON AS YOU GET SLOWED DOWN; DSND AND MAINTAIN 7000 FT.' SHORTLY AFTER WE WERE CLRED TO 4000 FT; EXPECTING A SHORT APCH. WHEN GIVEN A 210 DEG HDG TO TURN BACK TOWARD FINAL; ATC ASKED WHAT OUR SPD WAS. FO STATED; '250 KTS.' ATC THEN SAID; 'YOU WERE GIVEN 210 KTS. TIGHTEN YOUR TURN.' WE INCREASED OUR BANK ANGLE. ATC THEN SAID; 'STOP DSCNT. DO YOU SEE COMPANY TFC ON FINAL FOR RWY 27L AT 12 O'CLOCK?' WE THEN REPORTED TFC IN SIGHT AND WERE CLRED FOR VISUAL RWY 27R. WE WERE NEVER GIVEN 210 KTS; AND IF WE WERE; IT WAS NEVER ACKNOWLEDGED BY READBACK AND ATC NEVER NOTICED. WE ARE CERTAIN 210 KTS WASN'T EVER ASSIGNED AND IF IT WAS; WHY DIDN'T ATC CATCH IT SOONER AND LET US DSND 6000 FT AT 250 KTS? ONLY ONE FMS (FO'S) WAS WORKING WHICH FURTHER INCREASED OUR WORKLOAD AFTER 2 RWY ASSIGNMENTS IN JUST A FEW MINUTES. ITS POSSIBLE 210 WAS ASSIGNED BUT NEVER ACKNOWLEDGED DUE TO AN OVERWHELMING AMOUNT OF REASSIGNMENTS; VECTORS; BRIEFINGS; AND CHKLISTS. ATC SHOULD'VE BETTER PLANNED OUR APCH AND NOT PRESSURED US INTO SUCH A TIGHT TURN NEAR PARALLEL TFC. ITS CLR THEY WERE HAVING LOTS OF TFC ISSUES AND PLACED THEIR BURDEN ON US AT LAST MINUTE. IF THEY DON'T HEAR 210 KTS READ BACK; THEY SHOULD DEMAND IT. IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO SLOW TO A SPD YOU NEVER ACKNOWLEDGED.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.