Narrative:

I inquired from tug driver if all bags were on aircraft. He said waiting for 2 bags from air carrier Y. He said we can push and wait for them pushed back. I said 'no;' lets wait for the bags at the gate. We waited a few mins; then tug driver said 'he does not think bags are coming.' I said ok we will get push clearance. SOP etc; etc; etc; so we then pushed. On the push; tug driver 'cleared' us to start 'both' engines. We pushed back; started left engine; and was getting ready to start the right engine when out come baggage handlers; oblivious to the state of the right engine. Tug driver did not stop them from approaching aircraft or us from starting right engine. We obviously did not start the right engine. I queried the tug driver; he then requested to open cargo door. I said ok. The problem is with the game playing here with ramp; bags and an on time push at all costs. If we had not observed rampers approaching on right side; or if we were mid engine start; there would have been a safety issue. Sucked into engine; torching; blown away etc. This is becoming a safety issue. It seems 'on time push;' outweighs safety practices. Suggestion; before rampers approach aircraft after it is pushed back; get the tug driver concurrence that the captain has approved opening a cargo door and it is safe. To top off everything they charged us with the late push (2 mins) even after we responded to an ACARS from them; representing that aircraft was 2 mins late because of waiting for bags. On an operational note; is it cheaper to have an engine running; burning fuel or take a delay at the gate?

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: B757 CAPT REPORTS RAMPERS LOADING BAGS AFTER PUSH BACK DURING ENGINE STARTS; WITHOUT COMMUNICATING WITH THE PUSH BACK CREW OR THE COCKPIT.

Narrative: I INQUIRED FROM TUG DRIVER IF ALL BAGS WERE ON ACFT. HE SAID WAITING FOR 2 BAGS FROM ACR Y. HE SAID WE CAN PUSH AND WAIT FOR THEM PUSHED BACK. I SAID 'NO;' LETS WAIT FOR THE BAGS AT THE GATE. WE WAITED A FEW MINS; THEN TUG DRIVER SAID 'HE DOES NOT THINK BAGS ARE COMING.' I SAID OK WE WILL GET PUSH CLRNC. SOP ETC; ETC; ETC; SO WE THEN PUSHED. ON THE PUSH; TUG DRIVER 'CLRED' US TO START 'BOTH' ENGS. WE PUSHED BACK; STARTED L ENG; AND WAS GETTING READY TO START THE R ENG WHEN OUT COME BAGGAGE HANDLERS; OBLIVIOUS TO THE STATE OF THE R ENG. TUG DRIVER DID NOT STOP THEM FROM APCHING ACFT OR US FROM STARTING R ENG. WE OBVIOUSLY DID NOT START THE R ENG. I QUERIED THE TUG DRIVER; HE THEN REQUESTED TO OPEN CARGO DOOR. I SAID OK. THE PROB IS WITH THE GAME PLAYING HERE WITH RAMP; BAGS AND AN ON TIME PUSH AT ALL COSTS. IF WE HAD NOT OBSERVED RAMPERS APCHING ON R SIDE; OR IF WE WERE MID ENG START; THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN A SAFETY ISSUE. SUCKED INTO ENG; TORCHING; BLOWN AWAY ETC. THIS IS BECOMING A SAFETY ISSUE. IT SEEMS 'ON TIME PUSH;' OUTWEIGHS SAFETY PRACTICES. SUGGESTION; BEFORE RAMPERS APCH ACFT AFTER IT IS PUSHED BACK; GET THE TUG DRIVER CONCURRENCE THAT THE CAPT HAS APPROVED OPENING A CARGO DOOR AND IT IS SAFE. TO TOP OFF EVERYTHING THEY CHARGED US WITH THE LATE PUSH (2 MINS) EVEN AFTER WE RESPONDED TO AN ACARS FROM THEM; REPRESENTING THAT ACFT WAS 2 MINS LATE BECAUSE OF WAITING FOR BAGS. ON AN OPERATIONAL NOTE; IS IT CHEAPER TO HAVE AN ENG RUNNING; BURNING FUEL OR TAKE A DELAY AT THE GATE?

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.