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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 769058 |
Time | |
Date | 200801 |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : zzz.airport |
State Reference | US |
Altitude | msl single value : 37000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Marginal |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zzz.artcc |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B777-200 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : vacating altitude |
Route In Use | arrival : holding pattern |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Function | flight crew : captain observation : company check pilot oversight : pic |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 220 flight time total : 26500 flight time type : 3000 |
ASRS Report | 769058 |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : far other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Company |
Primary Problem | Company |
Narrative:
After returning from my break; just 3 hours prior to our scheduled landing at ZZZ on our flight from ZZZZ an 11 hour flight; the captain learned (for the first time) from one of our relief pilots we were relieving; that there was a scheduled vip departure from ZZZ around XA00 pm; very close to our scheduled arrival at XA25 pm. The captain jokingly said we'd better slow to holding speed right now. As it turned out; it wasn't a bad idea. Still about 2 hours out of ZZZ we began to hear evidence from ATC that things were beginning to back up at ZZZ when they started asking flts their speed and assigning headings for sequencing. Hearing this; the captain began to look for a message from our dispatcher notifying us of the vip situation. Unable to locate any message from dispatch captain sent a message to them as follows: 'what do you know about vip departing ZZZ today?' we received no response from the dispatcher on this request. The captain began to think the first officer was kidding about the vip visit to ZZZ since no mention of it had been made to us during the brief or after. We just couldn't believe something like this could have slipped through our fingers during the preflight preparations. It turns out the first officer had heard the news of the vip's visit to ZZZ the day before we departed to ZZZZ; so there was plenty of advance notice to the general public. It just seems the news did not reach dispatchers until the morning of his visit to ZZZ; by which time; of course; we had already departed ZZZZ; making the notion of adding a bit more fuel for the expected delays very difficult to achieve from FL350. After landing at ZZZ; the captain learned from our dispatcher; who was working the flight at our arrival time; that air carrier planning doesn't receive information on vip movements until the morning of the scheduled movement. This may be ok for local; short; domestic flts; but obviously does not cut it for longer international flts. As it turned out; approach was able to 'squeeze us in' only because we had been proactive with our fuel status; indicating that there was no way we would be able to hold until our efc. He said; 'just let me know when you're ready to divert then.' I said; 'ok; it looks like about 20 mins is all the hold time we have up here.' about 10 mins later; the controller said that due to our fuel state; ZZZ was going to take us. How nice! Saved by the controllers again! Still no word from our own dispatchers regarding any delays of any nature going into ZZZ today. Usually our dispatchers are really on the ball; but today; for some reason; the department was not up to specifications and we can only hope this is not a new trend in planning. I'm sure it is not but I thought this issue should be reviewed. I should add that our initial briefing was very professional and thorough; with regard to what information he had available at the time before our departure from ZZZ2. But the lack of information on the planned vip movement situation at ZZZ around our arrival time should have been included and dealt with before departure; not within 30 mi of ZZZ in a holding pattern with no hold fuel included in the flight planning.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B777 CAPT REPORTS ARRIVING ZZZ DURING VIP MOVEMENT; WITH INSUFFICIENT FUEL FOR THE EXPECTED HOLD. A DIVERSION IS AVOIDED WHEN ATC GIVES PREFERENCE TO ACFT NEARING MIN FUEL.
Narrative: AFTER RETURNING FROM MY BREAK; JUST 3 HRS PRIOR TO OUR SCHEDULED LNDG AT ZZZ ON OUR FLT FROM ZZZZ AN 11 HR FLT; THE CAPT LEARNED (FOR THE FIRST TIME) FROM ONE OF OUR RELIEF PLTS WE WERE RELIEVING; THAT THERE WAS A SCHEDULED VIP DEP FROM ZZZ AROUND XA00 PM; VERY CLOSE TO OUR SCHEDULED ARR AT XA25 PM. THE CAPT JOKINGLY SAID WE'D BETTER SLOW TO HOLDING SPD RIGHT NOW. AS IT TURNED OUT; IT WASN'T A BAD IDEA. STILL ABOUT 2 HRS OUT OF ZZZ WE BEGAN TO HEAR EVIDENCE FROM ATC THAT THINGS WERE BEGINNING TO BACK UP AT ZZZ WHEN THEY STARTED ASKING FLTS THEIR SPD AND ASSIGNING HDGS FOR SEQUENCING. HEARING THIS; THE CAPT BEGAN TO LOOK FOR A MESSAGE FROM OUR DISPATCHER NOTIFYING US OF THE VIP SITUATION. UNABLE TO LOCATE ANY MESSAGE FROM DISPATCH CAPT SENT A MESSAGE TO THEM AS FOLLOWS: 'WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT VIP DEPARTING ZZZ TODAY?' WE RECEIVED NO RESPONSE FROM THE DISPATCHER ON THIS REQUEST. THE CAPT BEGAN TO THINK THE FO WAS KIDDING ABOUT THE VIP VISIT TO ZZZ SINCE NO MENTION OF IT HAD BEEN MADE TO US DURING THE BRIEF OR AFTER. WE JUST COULDN'T BELIEVE SOMETHING LIKE THIS COULD HAVE SLIPPED THROUGH OUR FINGERS DURING THE PREFLT PREPARATIONS. IT TURNS OUT THE FO HAD HEARD THE NEWS OF THE VIP'S VISIT TO ZZZ THE DAY BEFORE WE DEPARTED TO ZZZZ; SO THERE WAS PLENTY OF ADVANCE NOTICE TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC. IT JUST SEEMS THE NEWS DID NOT REACH DISPATCHERS UNTIL THE MORNING OF HIS VISIT TO ZZZ; BY WHICH TIME; OF COURSE; WE HAD ALREADY DEPARTED ZZZZ; MAKING THE NOTION OF ADDING A BIT MORE FUEL FOR THE EXPECTED DELAYS VERY DIFFICULT TO ACHIEVE FROM FL350. AFTER LNDG AT ZZZ; THE CAPT LEARNED FROM OUR DISPATCHER; WHO WAS WORKING THE FLT AT OUR ARR TIME; THAT ACR PLANNING DOESN'T RECEIVE INFO ON VIP MOVEMENTS UNTIL THE MORNING OF THE SCHEDULED MOVEMENT. THIS MAY BE OK FOR LCL; SHORT; DOMESTIC FLTS; BUT OBVIOUSLY DOES NOT CUT IT FOR LONGER INTL FLTS. AS IT TURNED OUT; APCH WAS ABLE TO 'SQUEEZE US IN' ONLY BECAUSE WE HAD BEEN PROACTIVE WITH OUR FUEL STATUS; INDICATING THAT THERE WAS NO WAY WE WOULD BE ABLE TO HOLD UNTIL OUR EFC. HE SAID; 'JUST LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU'RE READY TO DIVERT THEN.' I SAID; 'OK; IT LOOKS LIKE ABOUT 20 MINS IS ALL THE HOLD TIME WE HAVE UP HERE.' ABOUT 10 MINS LATER; THE CTLR SAID THAT DUE TO OUR FUEL STATE; ZZZ WAS GOING TO TAKE US. HOW NICE! SAVED BY THE CTLRS AGAIN! STILL NO WORD FROM OUR OWN DISPATCHERS REGARDING ANY DELAYS OF ANY NATURE GOING INTO ZZZ TODAY. USUALLY OUR DISPATCHERS ARE REALLY ON THE BALL; BUT TODAY; FOR SOME REASON; THE DEPT WAS NOT UP TO SPECIFICATIONS AND WE CAN ONLY HOPE THIS IS NOT A NEW TREND IN PLANNING. I'M SURE IT IS NOT BUT I THOUGHT THIS ISSUE SHOULD BE REVIEWED. I SHOULD ADD THAT OUR INITIAL BRIEFING WAS VERY PROFESSIONAL AND THOROUGH; WITH REGARD TO WHAT INFO HE HAD AVAILABLE AT THE TIME BEFORE OUR DEP FROM ZZZ2. BUT THE LACK OF INFO ON THE PLANNED VIP MOVEMENT SITUATION AT ZZZ AROUND OUR ARR TIME SHOULD HAVE BEEN INCLUDED AND DEALT WITH BEFORE DEP; NOT WITHIN 30 MI OF ZZZ IN A HOLDING PATTERN WITH NO HOLD FUEL INCLUDED IN THE FLT PLANNING.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of May 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.