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Flight crew reporter dissatisfied with flipr 2 SID off lax. Regards SID as flight crew distracting to comply with. Necessary to give full attention to instruments in area of dense VFR and IFR traffic instead of looking for traffic.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 82567 |
| Time | |
| Date | 198802 |
| Day | Wed |
| Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : lax |
| State Reference | CA |
| Altitude | agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 0 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : zla tracon : lax tower : lax |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
| Navigation In Use | Other Other |
| Flight Phase | climbout : takeoff |
| Route In Use | departure other departure sid : sid enroute : on vectors enroute airway : lax enroute airway : zla |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 180 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 180 |
| ASRS Report | 82567 |
| Person 2 | |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | other anomaly other other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
| Consequence | Other |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | Chart Or Publication |
| Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
Situation: lax departure SID, flipr 2 departure, hazardous!!! The flipr 2 SID is a SID which has the flight crew mostly on instruments in VMC conditions when in fact the crews should be scanning outside for traffic IFR and VFR in the area of departure. This situation of flying too many instruments to comply with the SID is extremely hazardous, unsafe and leaves reduced reaction times for the crews in a highly dense traffic area of VFR and IFR traffic. Controllers talked to over the air express dissatisfaction and so do aircrews. This SID should be eliminated so that aircrews are not additionally task overwhelmed by robust SID navigation in an area of reduced visibility from smog, or in an environment of manmade induced workload. I feel that this SID is unsafe, hazardous and task overloaded and should be eliminated now.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLT CREW REPORTER DISSATISFIED WITH FLIPR 2 SID OFF LAX. REGARDS SID AS FLT CREW DISTRACTING TO COMPLY WITH. NECESSARY TO GIVE FULL ATTENTION TO INSTRUMENTS IN AREA OF DENSE VFR AND IFR TRAFFIC INSTEAD OF LOOKING FOR TRAFFIC.
Narrative: SITUATION: LAX DEP SID, FLIPR 2 DEP, HAZARDOUS!!! THE FLIPR 2 SID IS A SID WHICH HAS THE FLT CREW MOSTLY ON INSTRUMENTS IN VMC CONDITIONS WHEN IN FACT THE CREWS SHOULD BE SCANNING OUTSIDE FOR TFC IFR AND VFR IN THE AREA OF DEP. THIS SITUATION OF FLYING TOO MANY INSTRUMENTS TO COMPLY WITH THE SID IS EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS, UNSAFE AND LEAVES REDUCED REACTION TIMES FOR THE CREWS IN A HIGHLY DENSE TFC AREA OF VFR AND IFR TFC. CTLRS TALKED TO OVER THE AIR EXPRESS DISSATISFACTION AND SO DO AIRCREWS. THIS SID SHOULD BE ELIMINATED SO THAT AIRCREWS ARE NOT ADDITIONALLY TASK OVERWHELMED BY ROBUST SID NAV IN AN AREA OF REDUCED VIS FROM SMOG, OR IN AN ENVIRONMENT OF MANMADE INDUCED WORKLOAD. I FEEL THAT THIS SID IS UNSAFE, HAZARDOUS AND TASK OVERLOADED AND SHOULD BE ELIMINATED NOW.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.