Air carrier medium large transport tailpipe fire on start up.

Attributes
ACN	96138
Time
Date	198810
Day	Thu
Local Time Of Day	0601 To 1200
Place
Locale Reference	airport : lax
State Reference	CA
Altitude	agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 0
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng
Navigation In Use	Other
Flight Phase	ground : preflight
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : flight engineer pilot : atp
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 12000
ASRS Report	96138
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : instrument pilot : commercial
Events
Anomaly	aircraft equipment problem : less severe non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other other : unspecified
Resolutory Action	other
Consequence	faa : investigated other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Aircraft
Air Traffic Incident	Pilot Deviation other

Narrative:

Had a tailpipe fire during second start attempt of #2 engine. I was unable to put out fire by motoring engine. Maintenance used ground fire bottle of purple K through front of engine to extinguish fire. The following is a sequence of events: the first officer and I showed at approximately XA35L to perform originating preflight. We pulled out the handbook and used book to perform all cockpit/flight station checks. During pushback attempted start of #2 engine--no light off. I put fuel lever to cut off and motored engine for 60 seconds. Both first officer and I thought maybe one of the ignitors was not working, so I selected both. Attempted start of #1 engine. No light off. Followed same procedure. Asked ground mechanic on headset if he was aware of any problems or location of circuit breaker's. He stated that maintenance had worked on aircraft ignitors on ron and that circuit breaker's might be open. Sure enough, all 4 circuit breaker's were out. There was no write-up in forms to advise crew of maintenance work. By now at least 3 mins had gone by since first attempted start of #2 engine. Initiated start of #2 engine after circuit breaker's were reset. Had a normal start indication from the flight station indications. Ground mechanic on headset advised that we had a tailpipe fire--flames were shooting 15' out tail of engine--also known as torching. I continued start for approximately 15 seconds and still advised fire. I put fuel lever to cut off. Flame reduced to 4', but still fire. Continued to motor engine. Called for fire departure. Pulled fire handle and discharged agent. Still had fire in tailpipe. Another mechanic came to aircraft with ground fire bottle and extinguished fire by using agent into front of engine. We were still motoring engine until fire was out. Passenger were taken off aircraft normally. Suggestions: circuit breaker's pulled by maintenance should be tagged and reset, a nontoxic extinguisher should be in ground bottles, why didn't motoring engine clear fuel?, and change start abnormal procedures to indicate check and drain fuel before second attempt start.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: ACR MLG TAILPIPE FIRE ON START UP.

Narrative: HAD A TAILPIPE FIRE DURING SECOND START ATTEMPT OF #2 ENG. I WAS UNABLE TO PUT OUT FIRE BY MOTORING ENG. MAINT USED GND FIRE BOTTLE OF PURPLE K THROUGH FRONT OF ENG TO EXTINGUISH FIRE. THE FOLLOWING IS A SEQUENCE OF EVENTS: THE F/O AND I SHOWED AT APPROX XA35L TO PERFORM ORIGINATING PREFLT. WE PULLED OUT THE HANDBOOK AND USED BOOK TO PERFORM ALL COCKPIT/FLT STATION CHKS. DURING PUSHBACK ATTEMPTED START OF #2 ENG--NO LIGHT OFF. I PUT FUEL LEVER TO CUT OFF AND MOTORED ENG FOR 60 SECS. BOTH F/O AND I THOUGHT MAYBE ONE OF THE IGNITORS WAS NOT WORKING, SO I SELECTED BOTH. ATTEMPTED START OF #1 ENG. NO LIGHT OFF. FOLLOWED SAME PROC. ASKED GND MECH ON HEADSET IF HE WAS AWARE OF ANY PROBS OR LOCATION OF CB'S. HE STATED THAT MAINT HAD WORKED ON ACFT IGNITORS ON RON AND THAT CB'S MIGHT BE OPEN. SURE ENOUGH, ALL 4 CB'S WERE OUT. THERE WAS NO WRITE-UP IN FORMS TO ADVISE CREW OF MAINT WORK. BY NOW AT LEAST 3 MINS HAD GONE BY SINCE FIRST ATTEMPTED START OF #2 ENG. INITIATED START OF #2 ENG AFTER CB'S WERE RESET. HAD A NORMAL START INDICATION FROM THE FLT STATION INDICATIONS. GND MECH ON HEADSET ADVISED THAT WE HAD A TAILPIPE FIRE--FLAMES WERE SHOOTING 15' OUT TAIL OF ENG--ALSO KNOWN AS TORCHING. I CONTINUED START FOR APPROX 15 SECS AND STILL ADVISED FIRE. I PUT FUEL LEVER TO CUT OFF. FLAME REDUCED TO 4', BUT STILL FIRE. CONTINUED TO MOTOR ENG. CALLED FOR FIRE DEP. PULLED FIRE HANDLE AND DISCHARGED AGENT. STILL HAD FIRE IN TAILPIPE. ANOTHER MECH CAME TO ACFT WITH GND FIRE BOTTLE AND EXTINGUISHED FIRE BY USING AGENT INTO FRONT OF ENG. WE WERE STILL MOTORING ENG UNTIL FIRE WAS OUT. PAX WERE TAKEN OFF ACFT NORMALLY. SUGGESTIONS: CB'S PULLED BY MAINT SHOULD BE TAGGED AND RESET, A NONTOXIC EXTINGUISHER SHOULD BE IN GND BOTTLES, WHY DIDN'T MOTORING ENG CLEAR FUEL?, AND CHANGE START ABNORMAL PROCS TO INDICATE CHK AND DRAIN FUEL BEFORE SECOND ATTEMPT START.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.