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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 156274 |
Time | |
Date | 199009 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : sju |
State Reference | PR |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 29000 msl bound upper : 31000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : sju |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Widebody, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | climbout : intermediate altitude cruise other |
Route In Use | departure other enroute : atlantic enroute : other oceanic enroute airway : mjzs |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : cfi pilot : commercial pilot : atp pilot : flight engineer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 195 flight time total : 14000 flight time type : 1000 |
ASRS Report | 156274 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence other other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance other |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation other |
Narrative:
After takeoff from sju, sju center requested us to climb to 35000' by 220 NM from sju. At 190 mi out we were at 30500' and advised sju center that we could not make the crossing. I requested FL310 as a final altitude. Center asked if we could make 35000' by kraft intersection. I replied that we would like to have FL310 was a final. Center advised us to descend to FL290. We complied. A few moments later sju center read a clearance so fast that neither my first officer nor I had a chance to copy it, nor were sure that it was for us. I called center back and said that if that clearance was for us, we did not copy it and preferred our original filed route. We could not accept a clearance we did not understand. Center did not respond. I called again and still no response. I was under the impression that they were on the proverbial landline to ny working out an altitude for us. We continued on our originally assigned routing at the assigned altitude of 29000'. About 5 mins later an air carrier flight called us on 118.15 (our ATC frequency) and advised us that sju center wanted us to immediately climb to 31000' and turn to heading 180 degrees. We turned and climbed immediately and began heading back toward sju. We flew south for about 5 mins and could hear sju ATC talking to other flts. We called them a # of times and finally a new ATC person (female) answered our call. She immediately rattled off a new clearance on the east routing to jfk. I asked why the new route. She replied, 'ny cannot accept you at any altitude other than 26000 or 35000' on the original route.' I asked her why they did not give me that information in the first place. She said that if I had a problem to call them. It would have simple enough for sju center to advise our flight as to what altitudes were available on our original filed ATC flight plan. Rather, they chose to withhold the information and instead rammed a re-routing down our throats. Give the captain the information and he will make the decision. Unfortunately sju center knew the available altitudes and we did not. It appears the sju center personnel are getting into a power and control frame of mind and attitude, similar to the previous days of the illegal ATC strike. We do not need that kind of assistance from unprofessional ATC employees.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: WDB PIC COMPLAINS OF ATC HANDLING AND SHOWS AGGRESSION TOWARD THE ARTCC RADAR CTLR AND SYSTEM REGARDING AM AMENDED CLRNC INVOLVING EITHER AN ALT CHANGE OR A CHANGE OR ROUTE.
Narrative: AFTER TKOF FROM SJU, SJU CENTER REQUESTED US TO CLB TO 35000' BY 220 NM FROM SJU. AT 190 MI OUT WE WERE AT 30500' AND ADVISED SJU CENTER THAT WE COULD NOT MAKE THE XING. I REQUESTED FL310 AS A FINAL ALT. CENTER ASKED IF WE COULD MAKE 35000' BY KRAFT INTXN. I REPLIED THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO HAVE FL310 WAS A FINAL. CENTER ADVISED US TO DSND TO FL290. WE COMPLIED. A FEW MOMENTS LATER SJU CENTER READ A CLRNC SO FAST THAT NEITHER MY F/O NOR I HAD A CHANCE TO COPY IT, NOR WERE SURE THAT IT WAS FOR US. I CALLED CENTER BACK AND SAID THAT IF THAT CLRNC WAS FOR US, WE DID NOT COPY IT AND PREFERRED OUR ORIGINAL FILED RTE. WE COULD NOT ACCEPT A CLRNC WE DID NOT UNDERSTAND. CENTER DID NOT RESPOND. I CALLED AGAIN AND STILL NO RESPONSE. I WAS UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT THEY WERE ON THE PROVERBIAL LANDLINE TO NY WORKING OUT AN ALT FOR US. WE CONTINUED ON OUR ORIGINALLY ASSIGNED RTING AT THE ASSIGNED ALT OF 29000'. ABOUT 5 MINS LATER AN ACR FLT CALLED US ON 118.15 (OUR ATC FREQ) AND ADVISED US THAT SJU CENTER WANTED US TO IMMEDIATELY CLB TO 31000' AND TURN TO HDG 180 DEGS. WE TURNED AND CLBED IMMEDIATELY AND BEGAN HDG BACK TOWARD SJU. WE FLEW S FOR ABOUT 5 MINS AND COULD HEAR SJU ATC TALKING TO OTHER FLTS. WE CALLED THEM A # OF TIMES AND FINALLY A NEW ATC PERSON (FEMALE) ANSWERED OUR CALL. SHE IMMEDIATELY RATTLED OFF A NEW CLRNC ON THE E RTING TO JFK. I ASKED WHY THE NEW RTE. SHE REPLIED, 'NY CANNOT ACCEPT YOU AT ANY ALT OTHER THAN 26000 OR 35000' ON THE ORIGINAL RTE.' I ASKED HER WHY THEY DID NOT GIVE ME THAT INFO IN THE FIRST PLACE. SHE SAID THAT IF I HAD A PROB TO CALL THEM. IT WOULD HAVE SIMPLE ENOUGH FOR SJU CENTER TO ADVISE OUR FLT AS TO WHAT ALTS WERE AVAILABLE ON OUR ORIGINAL FILED ATC FLT PLAN. RATHER, THEY CHOSE TO WITHHOLD THE INFO AND INSTEAD RAMMED A RE-RTING DOWN OUR THROATS. GIVE THE CAPT THE INFO AND HE WILL MAKE THE DECISION. UNFORTUNATELY SJU CENTER KNEW THE AVAILABLE ALTS AND WE DID NOT. IT APPEARS THE SJU CENTER PERSONNEL ARE GETTING INTO A PWR AND CTL FRAME OF MIND AND ATTITUDE, SIMILAR TO THE PREVIOUS DAYS OF THE ILLEGAL ATC STRIKE. WE DO NOT NEED THAT KIND OF ASSISTANCE FROM UNPROFESSIONAL ATC EMPLOYEES.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.