Narrative:

The ground control of aircraft in the gate area is strictly a non-ATC function, the town or county owns and operates this movement of traffic. After push back you are directed to one of 7 spots (located on and between active txwys) and directed to contact ATC ground on an appropriate frequency. Sounds simple in theory however, there are many flaws that cause near misses on the ground. Air carrier alone operate 38 gates so there is a potential for 38 aircraft converging onto 7 spots (5:1 odds for a ground incident). Aircraft landing maximum of 38 must traverse these same spots to go to their receiving gates. Departing aircraft are monitoring ramp departure 131.6 and at the spot contact ground control 121.8. Arriving aircraft are monitoring ground control 121.9 and when on the ramp, ramp control 129.8. Here are the problems: aircraft are being assigned spots (the same spot for multiple aircraft) and no one is privileged to who is going where. Arriving aircraft being cleared to their gate and are not in communicado with departing aircraft results in a free for all on the ramp. Last and not least is the physical make-up of the spots, white numbers painted on a black box backgnd; painted on a lack tarmac. Try finding these spots on a dark rainy night with reduced visibility? In summary, you have aircraft taxiing out, aircraft taxiing in, no one knowing what the other persons intentions and half of them incommunicado. Solution: I don't feel we can butt heads with politics, ie...who controls the ramp versus txwys. But if prbessurbe could bbe put on thbe pwrs to be to berbect light signs indicating and illuminating the 'spots' and dividing the concourses with frequencys ie... A & B 129.8, C & C 131.6 this way aircraft in the same general vicinity would be aware of the ramp logistics. It amazes me how something this simple works in lax and dfw. Lets not risk lives for politics. Any further assistance solicted will be welcomed on my part, any questions please call. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following information. Analyst called facility to find out if they were experiencing any problems between ground control and ramp control. The following information was learned: facility had no problems with this set up. The ramp controller is non FAA and handles the entire ramp. Little coordination between ramp control and ground takes place. Ramp clears departure aircraft to specific departure spots and changes aircraft to ground usually at the spot, not before. All of the ramp area is designated as non ATC control. Ramp area is all concrete. The departure spots are painted black with a white number. Facility has had no problems with this, even during wet conditions. Analyst believes reporter feels uncomfortable because arrival and departure aircraft are on different frequencys.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: ACR MLG FLT CREW REPORTS THAT RAMP CTL AND RAMP OPERATIONS AT CLT NEED CHANGE.

Narrative: THE GND CTL OF ACFT IN THE GATE AREA IS STRICTLY A NON-ATC FUNCTION, THE TOWN OR COUNTY OWNS AND OPERATES THIS MOVEMENT OF TFC. AFTER PUSH BACK YOU ARE DIRECTED TO ONE OF 7 SPOTS (LOCATED ON AND BTWN ACTIVE TXWYS) AND DIRECTED TO CONTACT ATC GND ON AN APPROPRIATE FREQ. SOUNDS SIMPLE IN THEORY HOWEVER, THERE ARE MANY FLAWS THAT CAUSE NEAR MISSES ON THE GND. ACR ALONE OPERATE 38 GATES SO THERE IS A POTENTIAL FOR 38 ACFT CONVERGING ONTO 7 SPOTS (5:1 ODDS FOR A GND INCIDENT). ACFT LNDG MAX OF 38 MUST TRAVERSE THESE SAME SPOTS TO GO TO THEIR RECEIVING GATES. DEPARTING ACFT ARE MONITORING RAMP DEP 131.6 AND AT THE SPOT CONTACT GND CTL 121.8. ARRIVING ACFT ARE MONITORING GND CTL 121.9 AND WHEN ON THE RAMP, RAMP CTL 129.8. HERE ARE THE PROBS: ACFT ARE BEING ASSIGNED SPOTS (THE SAME SPOT FOR MULTIPLE ACFT) AND NO ONE IS PRIVILEGED TO WHO IS GOING WHERE. ARRIVING ACFT BEING CLRED TO THEIR GATE AND ARE NOT IN COMMUNICADO WITH DEPARTING ACFT RESULTS IN A FREE FOR ALL ON THE RAMP. LAST AND NOT LEAST IS THE PHYSICAL MAKE-UP OF THE SPOTS, WHITE NUMBERS PAINTED ON A BLACK BOX BACKGND; PAINTED ON A LACK TARMAC. TRY FINDING THESE SPOTS ON A DARK RAINY NIGHT WITH REDUCED VISIBILITY? IN SUMMARY, YOU HAVE ACFT TAXIING OUT, ACFT TAXIING IN, NO ONE KNOWING WHAT THE OTHER PERSONS INTENTIONS AND HALF OF THEM INCOMMUNICADO. SOLUTION: I DON'T FEEL WE CAN BUTT HEADS WITH POLITICS, IE...WHO CTLS THE RAMP VERSUS TXWYS. BUT IF PRBESSURBE COULD BBE PUT ON THBE PWRS TO BE TO BERBECT LIGHT SIGNS INDICATING AND ILLUMINATING THE 'SPOTS' AND DIVIDING THE CONCOURSES WITH FREQS IE... A & B 129.8, C & C 131.6 THIS WAY ACFT IN THE SAME GENERAL VICINITY WOULD BE AWARE OF THE RAMP LOGISTICS. IT AMAZES ME HOW SOMETHING THIS SIMPLE WORKS IN LAX AND DFW. LETS NOT RISK LIVES FOR POLITICS. ANY FURTHER ASSISTANCE SOLICTED WILL BE WELCOMED ON MY PART, ANY QUESTIONS PLEASE CALL. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO. ANALYST CALLED FAC TO FIND OUT IF THEY WERE EXPERIENCING ANY PROBS BTWN GND CTL AND RAMP CTL. THE FOLLOWING INFO WAS LEARNED: FAC HAD NO PROBS WITH THIS SET UP. THE RAMP CTLR IS NON FAA AND HANDLES THE ENTIRE RAMP. LITTLE COORD BTWN RAMP CTL AND GND TAKES PLACE. RAMP CLRS DEP ACFT TO SPECIFIC DEP SPOTS AND CHANGES ACFT TO GND USUALLY AT THE SPOT, NOT BEFORE. ALL OF THE RAMP AREA IS DESIGNATED AS NON ATC CTL. RAMP AREA IS ALL CONCRETE. THE DEP SPOTS ARE PAINTED BLACK WITH A WHITE NUMBER. FAC HAS HAD NO PROBS WITH THIS, EVEN DURING WET CONDITIONS. ANALYST BELIEVES RPTR FEELS UNCOMFORTABLE BECAUSE ARR AND DEP ACFT ARE ON DIFFERENT FREQS.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.