Narrative:

Flight is scheduled to operate sfo-lax-day-cmh. Aircraft arrival late into lax with a crew change for the next leg. Aircraft also had very minor mechanic. Aircraft involved was a standard advanced technology medium large transport. On a 4+06 scheduled flight. WX at lax was 12 broken, 5H 56/48 09/6 29.97. Poc was received by ACARS. Approximately 2 mins prior to pushback weight and balance was received over ACARS. It indicated a 'bleeds off' takeoff with runway 6R on 7L used. Runways in use at the time were 24/25. Several mins were spent in the performance manual attempting to determine if takeoff was possible on any of the 24's or 25's. Our figures indicated the only possibility would be a 'bleeds off, improved climb' takeoff from 25L. We asked operations for another weight and balance with these conditions set for 25L. Weight and balance received via ACARS confirmed our information. We contacted ground control .65 for push and were cleared to push #2 in the alley for 24L. We informed him we required 25L. He stated to expect 25R. We advised we ere unable 25R and requested 25L. He asked why? We explained that while 25R was longer it is also 'obstacle' limited in our performance manual and therefore unusable. He didn't seem to understand our requirements but advised us to expect 25L. While still waiting in the alley for traffic ahead, we received an ACARS message to call operations. They advised that the tower was on the phone requesting information on our request. We repeated the explanation to operations, and then began our taxi. At the '50 yard line' we contacted ground. .75 and were cleared to taxi to 25R. We advised we required 25L and a repeat of the previous conversation ensued. We were finally cleared 25L at intersection 8. At intersection 8 we contacted tower for takeoff and were advised to continue for 25 right full length, again, the conversation ensued why we need 25L which is 'shorter'. Finally, we were told to hold short of 25R at intersection 8 for 25L. An medium large transport (of the same type), departed runway 25R and we were cleared to cross 25R and advised a 3 min wake turbulence delay was necessary. The tone of the controller seemed 'coercive' in nature as if to say if you go off 25R there will be no delay. We waited the 3 mins and departed 25L. From that point on flight, was operations normal. It seems that in the 30 mins from call for pushback to takeoff somebody in the tower cabin attendant could have coordinated this better and saved a lot of time, effort and frustration. This is not the first time this situation or set of circumstances has occurred.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: PROBLEM IN INFO EXCHANGE BTWN ACR ADVANCED TECHNOLOGY FLC AND LAX TWR CTLRS REGARDING ACCEPTABILITY OF RWY FOR DEP DUE DEP OBSTACLE RESTRICTIONS FOR ACFT WEIGHT AND TEMP.

Narrative: FLT IS SCHEDULED TO OPERATE SFO-LAX-DAY-CMH. ACFT ARR LATE INTO LAX WITH A CREW CHANGE FOR THE NEXT LEG. ACFT ALSO HAD VERY MINOR MECH. ACFT INVOLVED WAS A STANDARD ADVANCED TECHNOLOGY MLG. ON A 4+06 SCHEDULED FLT. WX AT LAX WAS 12 BROKEN, 5H 56/48 09/6 29.97. POC WAS RECEIVED BY ACARS. APPROX 2 MINS PRIOR TO PUSHBACK WT AND BAL WAS RECEIVED OVER ACARS. IT INDICATED A 'BLEEDS OFF' TKOF WITH RWY 6R ON 7L USED. RWYS IN USE AT THE TIME WERE 24/25. SEVERAL MINS WERE SPENT IN THE PERFORMANCE MANUAL ATTEMPTING TO DETERMINE IF TKOF WAS POSSIBLE ON ANY OF THE 24'S OR 25'S. OUR FIGURES INDICATED THE ONLY POSSIBILITY WOULD BE A 'BLEEDS OFF, IMPROVED CLB' TKOF FROM 25L. WE ASKED OPS FOR ANOTHER WT AND BAL WITH THESE CONDITIONS SET FOR 25L. WT AND BAL RECEIVED VIA ACARS CONFIRMED OUR INFO. WE CONTACTED GND CTL .65 FOR PUSH AND WERE CLRED TO PUSH #2 IN THE ALLEY FOR 24L. WE INFORMED HIM WE REQUIRED 25L. HE STATED TO EXPECT 25R. WE ADVISED WE ERE UNABLE 25R AND REQUESTED 25L. HE ASKED WHY? WE EXPLAINED THAT WHILE 25R WAS LONGER IT IS ALSO 'OBSTACLE' LIMITED IN OUR PERFORMANCE MANUAL AND THEREFORE UNUSABLE. HE DIDN'T SEEM TO UNDERSTAND OUR REQUIREMENTS BUT ADVISED US TO EXPECT 25L. WHILE STILL WAITING IN THE ALLEY FOR TFC AHEAD, WE RECEIVED AN ACARS MESSAGE TO CALL OPS. THEY ADVISED THAT THE TWR WAS ON THE PHONE REQUESTING INFO ON OUR REQUEST. WE REPEATED THE EXPLANATION TO OPS, AND THEN BEGAN OUR TAXI. AT THE '50 YARD LINE' WE CONTACTED GND. .75 AND WERE CLRED TO TAXI TO 25R. WE ADVISED WE REQUIRED 25L AND A REPEAT OF THE PREVIOUS CONVERSATION ENSUED. WE WERE FINALLY CLRED 25L AT INTXN 8. AT INTXN 8 WE CONTACTED TWR FOR TKOF AND WERE ADVISED TO CONTINUE FOR 25 R FULL LENGTH, AGAIN, THE CONVERSATION ENSUED WHY WE NEED 25L WHICH IS 'SHORTER'. FINALLY, WE WERE TOLD TO HOLD SHORT OF 25R AT INTXN 8 FOR 25L. AN MLG (OF THE SAME TYPE), DEPARTED RWY 25R AND WE WERE CLRED TO CROSS 25R AND ADVISED A 3 MIN WAKE TURBULENCE DELAY WAS NECESSARY. THE TONE OF THE CTLR SEEMED 'COERCIVE' IN NATURE AS IF TO SAY IF YOU GO OFF 25R THERE WILL BE NO DELAY. WE WAITED THE 3 MINS AND DEPARTED 25L. FROM THAT POINT ON FLT, WAS OPS NORMAL. IT SEEMS THAT IN THE 30 MINS FROM CALL FOR PUSHBACK TO TKOF SOMEBODY IN THE TWR CAB COULD HAVE COORDINATED THIS BETTER AND SAVED A LOT OF TIME, EFFORT AND FRUSTRATION. THIS IS NOT THE FIRST TIME THIS SITUATION OR SET OF CIRCUMSTANCES HAS OCCURRED.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.