37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 304049 |
Time | |
Date | 199505 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : mia |
State Reference | FL |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 3000 msl bound upper : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : mia |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | SF 340B |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B727 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : approach landing other |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 7800 flight time type : 3000 |
ASRS Report | 304049 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : instrument |
Events | |
Anomaly | inflight encounter other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : unable none taken : detected after the fact |
Consequence | other |
Supplementary | |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
We were operating flight from tampa to miami. We were vectored to join the runway 09R localizer at 3000 ft about 12 mi out. Our traffic to follow was a B727 3-4 mi ahead at our 2 O'clock position who was on a vector to join. ATC pointed him out by relative position and 'above.' our TCASII showed the b- 727 to be level at 7000 ft. The B727 overshot the localizer and did not begin its descent until finally established and about 7 mi out. We had not heard ATC give him a descent clearance, so I don't know why he waited so long to descend. The B727 was operated by a domestic carrier. Tower had us 'slow to 150 KIAS and maintain visual, caution wake turbulence.' needless to say we ran right into it, and when I reported it to the tower he said 'that's why I had you slow down.' he apparently does not visualize 3 dimensionally. I strongly recommend no large or heavy aircraft be allowed to join an approach when substantially (over 1000-1500 ft) above the following aircraft. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following: reporter is adamant that something be done about descending larger jet aircraft down through their landing profile and leaving a wake that cannot be avoided. Although his aircraft did not lose any altitude, it was out of control for about 4 seconds. Both pilots had hands on the control to try to level wings. Bank went from 70 degrees to lesser amounts to the left and right. Flight crew had good visual conditions and felt they would encounter the wake, but never thought about or considered deviating to the side to avoid wake. Reporter wants something done that changes large jets from descending through their altitude.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: WAKE TURB ENCOUNTER.
Narrative: WE WERE OPERATING FLT FROM TAMPA TO MIAMI. WE WERE VECTORED TO JOIN THE RWY 09R LOC AT 3000 FT ABOUT 12 MI OUT. OUR TFC TO FOLLOW WAS A B727 3-4 MI AHEAD AT OUR 2 O'CLOCK POS WHO WAS ON A VECTOR TO JOIN. ATC POINTED HIM OUT BY RELATIVE POS AND 'ABOVE.' OUR TCASII SHOWED THE B- 727 TO BE LEVEL AT 7000 FT. THE B727 OVERSHOT THE LOC AND DID NOT BEGIN ITS DSCNT UNTIL FINALLY ESTABLISHED AND ABOUT 7 MI OUT. WE HAD NOT HEARD ATC GIVE HIM A DSCNT CLRNC, SO I DON'T KNOW WHY HE WAITED SO LONG TO DSND. THE B727 WAS OPERATED BY A DOMESTIC CARRIER. TWR HAD US 'SLOW TO 150 KIAS AND MAINTAIN VISUAL, CAUTION WAKE TURB.' NEEDLESS TO SAY WE RAN RIGHT INTO IT, AND WHEN I RPTED IT TO THE TWR HE SAID 'THAT'S WHY I HAD YOU SLOW DOWN.' HE APPARENTLY DOES NOT VISUALIZE 3 DIMENSIONALLY. I STRONGLY RECOMMEND NO LARGE OR HVY ACFT BE ALLOWED TO JOIN AN APCH WHEN SUBSTANTIALLY (OVER 1000-1500 FT) ABOVE THE FOLLOWING ACFT. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH REPORTER REVEALED THE FOLLOWING: RPTR IS ADAMANT THAT SOMETHING BE DONE ABOUT DSNDING LARGER JET ACFT DOWN THROUGH THEIR LNDG PROFILE AND LEAVING A WAKE THAT CANNOT BE AVOIDED. ALTHOUGH HIS ACFT DID NOT LOSE ANY ALT, IT WAS OUT OF CTL FOR ABOUT 4 SECONDS. BOTH PLTS HAD HANDS ON THE CTL TO TRY TO LEVEL WINGS. BANK WENT FROM 70 DEGS TO LESSER AMOUNTS TO THE L AND R. FLC HAD GOOD VISUAL CONDITIONS AND FELT THEY WOULD ENCOUNTER THE WAKE, BUT NEVER THOUGHT ABOUT OR CONSIDERED DEVIATING TO THE SIDE TO AVOID WAKE. RPTR WANTS SOMETHING DONE THAT CHANGES LARGE JETS FROM DSNDING THROUGH THEIR ALT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.