37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 329086 |
Time | |
Date | 199602 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : jfk |
State Reference | NY |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 400 msl bound upper : 2000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | IMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : jfk artcc : zoa |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Widebody, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
ASRS Report | 329086 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
ASRS Report | 329495 |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
Came back to cockpit from rest break to find jfk calling CAT ii/III WX to runway 04, bna as alternate. After 11 hour flight. ATC was calling for WX CAT ii/III runway 04. On our vectors to runway 04 ATC switched to runway 31R and called WX as 400 ft, 1 mi visibility. They didn't tell us runway 04 localizer went OTS during our vectors to runway 04 or runway 31R. Cleared for approach to runway 31R with 4000 ft localizer intercept just outside the OM, we set up a steep graduated rate of descent manually with vertical speed to intercept GS from above, intercepting GS at 400 ft with 800 ft rate of descent, got the GPWS terrain warning, initiated manual go around following v-bars with 3000 FPM rate of climb. At 1500 ft ATC advised to level at 2000 ft. Bear in mind we never broke out at 400 ft. Also published missed approach calls for 4000 ft, not 2000 ft. With the high rate of climb, go around power, manual control go around, high nose attitude, we bumped past 2000 ft to 2300 ft then back down to 2000 ft. Accepted another vector to runway 31R at 2000 ft without incident, but broke out at 200 ft and 1/2 mi, not the 400 ft 1 mi visibility they insisted in giving us for runway 31R. No RVR was ever reported. ATC needs to be more aware of aircraft type they are controling, aircraft performance, don't set us up 2000 ft above the normal GS intercept altitude. Don't set us up to intercept the GS from above that close in to OM, report the real time WX and not scam us with WX that accommodates their choice of runways. Provide real WX not bogus WX guess, realize also that the crew is coming off a 10-11 hour flight and crew fatigue. And workload combinations with WX.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: AFTER LONG FLT, FLC FATIGUED, CLRED FOR CAT II III APCH, VECTORED AT 4000 FT JUST OUTSIDE OF OM. IN ORDER TO DSND TO GLIDE PATH, FLC HAD TO USE EXCESSIVE DSCNT, CLOSE IN, WHICH SET OFF GPWS. FLC EXECUTED GAR AND BACK FOR ANOTHER UNEVENTFUL APCH. WX WAS LOWER THAN RPTED BY ATIS AND APCH CTL.
Narrative: CAME BACK TO COCKPIT FROM REST BREAK TO FIND JFK CALLING CAT II/III WX TO RWY 04, BNA AS ALTERNATE. AFTER 11 HR FLT. ATC WAS CALLING FOR WX CAT II/III RWY 04. ON OUR VECTORS TO RWY 04 ATC SWITCHED TO RWY 31R AND CALLED WX AS 400 FT, 1 MI VIS. THEY DIDN'T TELL US RWY 04 LOC WENT OTS DURING OUR VECTORS TO RWY 04 OR RWY 31R. CLRED FOR APCH TO RWY 31R WITH 4000 FT LOC INTERCEPT JUST OUTSIDE THE OM, WE SET UP A STEEP GRADUATED RATE OF DSCNT MANUALLY WITH VERT SPD TO INTERCEPT GS FROM ABOVE, INTERCEPTING GS AT 400 FT WITH 800 FT RATE OF DSCNT, GOT THE GPWS TERRAIN WARNING, INITIATED MANUAL GAR FOLLOWING V-BARS WITH 3000 FPM RATE OF CLB. AT 1500 FT ATC ADVISED TO LEVEL AT 2000 FT. BEAR IN MIND WE NEVER BROKE OUT AT 400 FT. ALSO PUBLISHED MISSED APCH CALLS FOR 4000 FT, NOT 2000 FT. WITH THE HIGH RATE OF CLB, GAR PWR, MANUAL CTL GAR, HIGH NOSE ATTITUDE, WE BUMPED PAST 2000 FT TO 2300 FT THEN BACK DOWN TO 2000 FT. ACCEPTED ANOTHER VECTOR TO RWY 31R AT 2000 FT WITHOUT INCIDENT, BUT BROKE OUT AT 200 FT AND 1/2 MI, NOT THE 400 FT 1 MI VIS THEY INSISTED IN GIVING US FOR RWY 31R. NO RVR WAS EVER RPTED. ATC NEEDS TO BE MORE AWARE OF ACFT TYPE THEY ARE CTLING, ACFT PERFORMANCE, DON'T SET US UP 2000 FT ABOVE THE NORMAL GS INTERCEPT ALT. DON'T SET US UP TO INTERCEPT THE GS FROM ABOVE THAT CLOSE IN TO OM, RPT THE REAL TIME WX AND NOT SCAM US WITH WX THAT ACCOMMODATES THEIR CHOICE OF RWYS. PROVIDE REAL WX NOT BOGUS WX GUESS, REALIZE ALSO THAT THE CREW IS COMING OFF A 10-11 HR FLT AND CREW FATIGUE. AND WORKLOAD COMBINATIONS WITH WX.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.