 |
37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Flight crew was advised of conflicting traffic and its altitude. Reporter flight crew was at 2500 ft and traffic reported at 2400 ft. Reporter instructor and trainee looked for, but didn't see the intruder until tower reported 100 ft vertical separation and 1000 ft horizontal. Reporter says they should have descended earlier, but thought ATC would provide more information and that they had more time to locate traffic.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 330737 |
| Time | |
| Date | 199603 |
| Day | Sun |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : azo |
| State Reference | MI |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 2500 msl bound upper : 2500 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tower : azo |
| Operator | general aviation : instructional |
| Make Model Name | Mooney Aircraft Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Flight Phase | cruise other descent : approach |
| Flight Plan | None |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Operator | general aviation : personal |
| Make Model Name | Cessna 150 |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Flight Phase | cruise other |
| Flight Plan | None |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | Other |
| Function | instruction : instructor |
| Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : instrument |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 25 flight time total : 1600 flight time type : 1000 |
| ASRS Report | 330737 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | Other |
| Function | instruction : trainee |
| Qualification | pilot : student |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | conflict : nmac other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | flight crew : took evasive action |
| Consequence | Other |
| Miss Distance | horizontal : 1000 vertical : 100 |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Narrative:
We called approach about 3 mi west of plainwell and radar contact was established. Almost at once we were passed to kalamazoo tower. A min or two went by and they called traffic 9 to 10 O'clock 5 mi wbound. Altitude indicates 2400 ft. I acknowledged the transmission and went to extra scanning mode. In that area, to my surprise neither I nor the student saw the airplane. Our heading was 150 degrees approximately. I decided to hold what I had for the moment and find the aircraft before making a move. I did not know where the other was headed or its type. I suspected it might be climbing out of battle creek. I also expected additional help from ATC. I got no additional help from ATC until just after I saw the other aircraft. He said we show within 100 ft vertical separation and I would estimate 1000+ ft horizontal separation. The other aircraft passed behind mine, a mooney with a much higher speed than my 150 KTS. Two things, I should have descended at the first call, but really assumed more time than I had. During this whole affair we were looking for the aircraft. The student had the opposite reaction and climbed very slightly about 250-350 ft and this old airplane had the altimeter hidden behind the student's left knee. Will also do more wing lifts to clear the area in the future.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLC WAS ADVISED OF CONFLICTING TFC AND ITS ALT. RPTR FLC WAS AT 2500 FT AND TFC RPTED AT 2400 FT. RPTR INSTRUCTOR AND TRAINEE LOOKED FOR, BUT DIDN'T SEE THE INTRUDER UNTIL TWR RPTED 100 FT VERT SEPARATION AND 1000 FT HORIZ. RPTR SAYS THEY SHOULD HAVE DSNDED EARLIER, BUT THOUGHT ATC WOULD PROVIDE MORE INFO AND THAT THEY HAD MORE TIME TO LOCATE TFC.
Narrative: WE CALLED APCH ABOUT 3 MI W OF PLAINWELL AND RADAR CONTACT WAS ESTABLISHED. ALMOST AT ONCE WE WERE PASSED TO KALAMAZOO TWR. A MIN OR TWO WENT BY AND THEY CALLED TFC 9 TO 10 O'CLOCK 5 MI WBOUND. ALT INDICATES 2400 FT. I ACKNOWLEDGED THE XMISSION AND WENT TO EXTRA SCANNING MODE. IN THAT AREA, TO MY SURPRISE NEITHER I NOR THE STUDENT SAW THE AIRPLANE. OUR HDG WAS 150 DEGS APPROX. I DECIDED TO HOLD WHAT I HAD FOR THE MOMENT AND FIND THE ACFT BEFORE MAKING A MOVE. I DID NOT KNOW WHERE THE OTHER WAS HEADED OR ITS TYPE. I SUSPECTED IT MIGHT BE CLBING OUT OF BATTLE CREEK. I ALSO EXPECTED ADDITIONAL HELP FROM ATC. I GOT NO ADDITIONAL HELP FROM ATC UNTIL JUST AFTER I SAW THE OTHER ACFT. HE SAID WE SHOW WITHIN 100 FT VERT SEPARATION AND I WOULD ESTIMATE 1000+ FT HORIZ SEPARATION. THE OTHER ACFT PASSED BEHIND MINE, A MOONEY WITH A MUCH HIGHER SPD THAN MY 150 KTS. TWO THINGS, I SHOULD HAVE DSNDED AT THE FIRST CALL, BUT REALLY ASSUMED MORE TIME THAN I HAD. DURING THIS WHOLE AFFAIR WE WERE LOOKING FOR THE ACFT. THE STUDENT HAD THE OPPOSITE REACTION AND CLBED VERY SLIGHTLY ABOUT 250-350 FT AND THIS OLD AIRPLANE HAD THE ALTIMETER HIDDEN BEHIND THE STUDENT'S L KNEE. WILL ALSO DO MORE WING LIFTS TO CLR THE AREA IN THE FUTURE.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.