Aircraft descends below class B airspace during a visual approach, while another aircraft descends below 8000 ft before they were past sannd intersection.

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Attributes
ACN	347400
Time
Date	199609
Day	Sun
Local Time Of Day	0601 To 1200
Place
Locale Reference	airport : slc
State Reference	UT
Altitude	msl bound lower : 6000 msl bound upper : 6000
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : slc
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	B737-300
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 121
Navigation In Use	Other Other
Flight Phase	descent : approach
Route In Use	approach : visual
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 6000 flight time type : 4000
ASRS Report	347400
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : commercial pilot : instrument
Events
Anomaly	altitude deviation : overshoot non adherence : published procedure non adherence : far non adherence : clearance other anomaly other
Independent Detector	aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	none taken : detected after the fact none taken : anomaly accepted none taken : insufficient time
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Flight Crew Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	Pilot Deviation other

Narrative:

At 8000 ft downwind, cleared for visual approach to runway 17. Approach to runway 17 has 6000 ft altitude on it, all others have step down altitudes. We descended to 6000 ft outside of 13 DME, putting us below the floor of the TCA until we got closer to the field. Maybe the runway 17 ILS plate should have some step down altitudes like the other approachs to help keep us in the class B airspace. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following information: reporter was positive that once in class B airspace, it was not possible to legally leave and enter it at will even though he was flying a visual approach. He was informed that when on a visual clearance, altitudes were up to his discretion, however he would have to comply with the speed restr for flying below any class B airspace. The other aircraft simply descended to a lower altitude without clearance. That flight crew feels strongly they were following the instructions of the controller, that the controller is the one who made an error in commanding the lower altitude. They knew they were not to be at the lower altitude but were certain the controller wanted them there. They were VFR at the time and felt there was no hazard.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: ACFT DSNDS BELOW CLASS B AIRSPACE DURING A VISUAL APCH, WHILE ANOTHER ACFT DSNDS BELOW 8000 FT BEFORE THEY WERE PAST SANND INTXN.

Narrative: AT 8000 FT DOWNWIND, CLRED FOR VISUAL APCH TO RWY 17. APCH TO RWY 17 HAS 6000 FT ALT ON IT, ALL OTHERS HAVE STEP DOWN ALTS. WE DSNDED TO 6000 FT OUTSIDE OF 13 DME, PUTTING US BELOW THE FLOOR OF THE TCA UNTIL WE GOT CLOSER TO THE FIELD. MAYBE THE RWY 17 ILS PLATE SHOULD HAVE SOME STEP DOWN ALTS LIKE THE OTHER APCHS TO HELP KEEP US IN THE CLASS B AIRSPACE. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: RPTR WAS POSITIVE THAT ONCE IN CLASS B AIRSPACE, IT WAS NOT POSSIBLE TO LEGALLY LEAVE AND ENTER IT AT WILL EVEN THOUGH HE WAS FLYING A VISUAL APCH. HE WAS INFORMED THAT WHEN ON A VISUAL CLRNC, ALTS WERE UP TO HIS DISCRETION, HOWEVER HE WOULD HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE SPD RESTR FOR FLYING BELOW ANY CLASS B AIRSPACE. THE OTHER ACFT SIMPLY DSNDED TO A LOWER ALT WITHOUT CLRNC. THAT FLC FEELS STRONGLY THEY WERE FOLLOWING THE INSTRUCTIONS OF THE CTLR, THAT THE CTLR IS THE ONE WHO MADE AN ERROR IN COMMANDING THE LOWER ALT. THEY KNEW THEY WERE NOT TO BE AT THE LOWER ALT BUT WERE CERTAIN THE CTLR WANTED THEM THERE. THEY WERE VFR AT THE TIME AND FELT THERE WAS NO HAZARD.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.