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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 359134 |
Time | |
Date | 199701 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : mow |
State Reference | FO |
Altitude | agl bound lower : 1000 agl bound upper : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : mow tower : mow |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other |
Route In Use | arrival other enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi pilot : instrument |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 7500 flight time type : 1600 |
ASRS Report | 359134 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : cfi pilot : atp pilot : commercial pilot : flight engineer pilot : instrument |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 110 flight time type : 407 |
ASRS Report | 360032 |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : overshoot non adherence : clearance non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : returned to intended course or assigned course none taken : detected after the fact other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Operational Deviation Pilot Deviation other |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
During our arrival into moscow, we were initially cleared for the 'UM25B.' overhead the 'bw' NDB we were then given radar vectors and a descent to 3100 meters. The approach pages all indicate that qnh is available upon request and transition occurs around 1500 meters (or approximately 4000 ft). When cleared for each subsequent altitude below transition, we asked approach to confirm altitudes were based on qnh and we were assured that they were. We were passed off to svo tower at approximately 1200 ft AGL on a heading of 180 degrees which was a 70 degree intercept heading to the ILS to runway 25L. The first indication that we were below the desired or intended altitude was when the tower controller advised us that we were almost 200 meters low. We were still above 1000 ft AGL and began a climb up to intercept the GS. We were in full VMC conditions with the field in sight. The problem could have been avoided if the controller had understood that we were intending to fly altitudes based on qnh, which we asked each time a new altitude was assigned and were assured by the controller that indeed it was qnh, or if we had stayed on the published arrival where both qnh and QFE (in parenthesis) altitudes were published or simply fly the QFE procedures, which in the worst case scenario always put the aircraft above the intended or cleared altitude if qnh altitudes were assigned, inadvertently. Supplemental information from acn 360032: upon arrival in the moscow area, the flight engineer received the ATIS and we planned the approach. The briefing was completed and we referenced that qnh was available upon request so we briefed that we would use qnh.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B747F IN FOREIGN AIRSPACE DURING A NIGHT OP EXPERIENCES AN ALTDEV ALT OVERSHOT WHEN ALTIMETER SETTING PROCS USED WERE BASED ON QFE VERSUS QNH.
Narrative: DURING OUR ARR INTO MOSCOW, WE WERE INITIALLY CLRED FOR THE 'UM25B.' OVERHEAD THE 'BW' NDB WE WERE THEN GIVEN RADAR VECTORS AND A DSCNT TO 3100 METERS. THE APCH PAGES ALL INDICATE THAT QNH IS AVAILABLE UPON REQUEST AND TRANSITION OCCURS AROUND 1500 METERS (OR APPROX 4000 FT). WHEN CLRED FOR EACH SUBSEQUENT ALT BELOW TRANSITION, WE ASKED APCH TO CONFIRM ALTS WERE BASED ON QNH AND WE WERE ASSURED THAT THEY WERE. WE WERE PASSED OFF TO SVO TWR AT APPROX 1200 FT AGL ON A HDG OF 180 DEGS WHICH WAS A 70 DEG INTERCEPT HDG TO THE ILS TO RWY 25L. THE FIRST INDICATION THAT WE WERE BELOW THE DESIRED OR INTENDED ALT WAS WHEN THE TWR CTLR ADVISED US THAT WE WERE ALMOST 200 METERS LOW. WE WERE STILL ABOVE 1000 FT AGL AND BEGAN A CLB UP TO INTERCEPT THE GS. WE WERE IN FULL VMC CONDITIONS WITH THE FIELD IN SIGHT. THE PROB COULD HAVE BEEN AVOIDED IF THE CTLR HAD UNDERSTOOD THAT WE WERE INTENDING TO FLY ALTS BASED ON QNH, WHICH WE ASKED EACH TIME A NEW ALT WAS ASSIGNED AND WERE ASSURED BY THE CTLR THAT INDEED IT WAS QNH, OR IF WE HAD STAYED ON THE PUBLISHED ARR WHERE BOTH QNH AND QFE (IN PARENTHESIS) ALTS WERE PUBLISHED OR SIMPLY FLY THE QFE PROCS, WHICH IN THE WORST CASE SCENARIO ALWAYS PUT THE ACFT ABOVE THE INTENDED OR CLRED ALT IF QNH ALTS WERE ASSIGNED, INADVERTENTLY. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 360032: UPON ARR IN THE MOSCOW AREA, THE FE RECEIVED THE ATIS AND WE PLANNED THE APCH. THE BRIEFING WAS COMPLETED AND WE REFED THAT QNH WAS AVAILABLE UPON REQUEST SO WE BRIEFED THAT WE WOULD USE QNH.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.