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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 436592 |
Time | |
Date | 199905 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | navaid : ali.vor |
State Reference | TX |
Altitude | msl single value : 8500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zhu.artcc |
Operator | general aviation : corporate |
Make Model Name | Cessna 210 Centurion / Turbo Centurion 210C, 210D |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | cruise : level |
Route In Use | enroute : direct |
Flight Plan | None |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : corporate |
Function | flight crew : single pilot |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : commercial pilot : instrument pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 4000 flight time type : 1500 |
ASRS Report | 436592 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | government : military |
Function | controller : approach |
Qualification | controller : military controller : radar |
Events | |
Anomaly | airspace violation : entry non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllerb |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance flight crew : exited penetrated airspace |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Inter Facility Coordination Failure Operational Deviation |
Narrative:
Nwbound from crp to eagle pass, tx (6ta4) (private). While receiving radar advisories from kingsville approach, we asked if they would check ahead to see if R6312 was 'hot.' they said stand by and we'll find out. After about 1 min, they (kingsville approach) called us back and said R6312 was inactive at this time (we were about to enter it). We read back we understand R6312 is cold and we would not be going around it. This is quite common with R6312. We taxied this route frequently. Kingsville said to contact ZHU and gave us a frequency. We contacted them and they yelled at us for entering a hot restr area! They gave us a turn. We complied immediately. We explained what happened. They told us kingsville didn't control that airspace -- they (ZHU) did. We told ZHU we knew that and asked kingsville to 'check ahead' for us. Kingsville came back and told us they had checked and it was cold. Center seemed to be more upset with kingsville than with us once they learned what we had done. Center said kingsville acknowledged what we had said but kingsville did not even check with ZHU about the status. This is awkward because kingsville controls the low altitude airspeed, right up to the east side of R6312. Center doesn't want to talk to you until you are west of kingsville airspace (which begins with R6312). It was also very hazy due to heat/humidity and we were looking into the sun, which made matters worse. ZHU said the area had F16's using live bombs (practice) in R6312. There were no close calls -- just made all involved nervous. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following information: analyst spoke with ZHU specialist(south) and was told ZHU is the controling agency and nqi base operations is the scheduling agency for R6312. The published usage data for R6312 is from sunrise to sunset, 7 days a week, surface to 12000 ft. Any other usage time(south) are by NOTAM, issued by ZHU through the FSS. ZHU receives a daily and/or weekly schedule from nqi base operations on what activity will be taking place within the area. The ZHU sector concerned is given this information. ZHU very seldom receives any updates of cancellations or additions from nqi. As a result of this, unless ZHU receives information to the contrary, R6312 is considered 'hot' as per the published charted times, even though there may be no aircraft in the airspace. Callback conversation with nqi approach revealed the following information: a request by an aircraft to check if R6312 is active or not, they would call nqi base operations and obtain the information. None of this information is given to ZHU on a regular basis.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACFT X ENTERED RESTR AREA EVEN THOUGH THE CTR SHOWED IT IN USE, SUBSEQUENTLY WAS GIVEN TURN TO CLR AREA.
Narrative: NWBOUND FROM CRP TO EAGLE PASS, TX (6TA4) (PVT). WHILE RECEIVING RADAR ADVISORIES FROM KINGSVILLE APCH, WE ASKED IF THEY WOULD CHK AHEAD TO SEE IF R6312 WAS 'HOT.' THEY SAID STAND BY AND WE'LL FIND OUT. AFTER ABOUT 1 MIN, THEY (KINGSVILLE APCH) CALLED US BACK AND SAID R6312 WAS INACTIVE AT THIS TIME (WE WERE ABOUT TO ENTER IT). WE READ BACK WE UNDERSTAND R6312 IS COLD AND WE WOULD NOT BE GOING AROUND IT. THIS IS QUITE COMMON WITH R6312. WE TAXIED THIS RTE FREQUENTLY. KINGSVILLE SAID TO CONTACT ZHU AND GAVE US A FREQ. WE CONTACTED THEM AND THEY YELLED AT US FOR ENTERING A HOT RESTR AREA! THEY GAVE US A TURN. WE COMPLIED IMMEDIATELY. WE EXPLAINED WHAT HAPPENED. THEY TOLD US KINGSVILLE DIDN'T CTL THAT AIRSPACE -- THEY (ZHU) DID. WE TOLD ZHU WE KNEW THAT AND ASKED KINGSVILLE TO 'CHK AHEAD' FOR US. KINGSVILLE CAME BACK AND TOLD US THEY HAD CHKED AND IT WAS COLD. CTR SEEMED TO BE MORE UPSET WITH KINGSVILLE THAN WITH US ONCE THEY LEARNED WHAT WE HAD DONE. CTR SAID KINGSVILLE ACKNOWLEDGED WHAT WE HAD SAID BUT KINGSVILLE DID NOT EVEN CHK WITH ZHU ABOUT THE STATUS. THIS IS AWKWARD BECAUSE KINGSVILLE CTLS THE LOW ALT AIRSPD, RIGHT UP TO THE E SIDE OF R6312. CTR DOESN'T WANT TO TALK TO YOU UNTIL YOU ARE W OF KINGSVILLE AIRSPACE (WHICH BEGINS WITH R6312). IT WAS ALSO VERY HAZY DUE TO HEAT/HUMIDITY AND WE WERE LOOKING INTO THE SUN, WHICH MADE MATTERS WORSE. ZHU SAID THE AREA HAD F16'S USING LIVE BOMBS (PRACTICE) IN R6312. THERE WERE NO CLOSE CALLS -- JUST MADE ALL INVOLVED NERVOUS. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: ANALYST SPOKE WITH ZHU SPECIALIST(S) AND WAS TOLD ZHU IS THE CTLING AGENCY AND NQI BASE OPS IS THE SCHEDULING AGENCY FOR R6312. THE PUBLISHED USAGE DATA FOR R6312 IS FROM SUNRISE TO SUNSET, 7 DAYS A WK, SURFACE TO 12000 FT. ANY OTHER USAGE TIME(S) ARE BY NOTAM, ISSUED BY ZHU THROUGH THE FSS. ZHU RECEIVES A DAILY AND/OR WKLY SCHEDULE FROM NQI BASE OPS ON WHAT ACTIVITY WILL BE TAKING PLACE WITHIN THE AREA. THE ZHU SECTOR CONCERNED IS GIVEN THIS INFO. ZHU VERY SELDOM RECEIVES ANY UPDATES OF CANCELLATIONS OR ADDITIONS FROM NQI. AS A RESULT OF THIS, UNLESS ZHU RECEIVES INFO TO THE CONTRARY, R6312 IS CONSIDERED 'HOT' AS PER THE PUBLISHED CHARTED TIMES, EVEN THOUGH THERE MAY BE NO ACFT IN THE AIRSPACE. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH NQI APCH REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: A REQUEST BY AN ACFT TO CHK IF R6312 IS ACTIVE OR NOT, THEY WOULD CALL NQI BASE OPS AND OBTAIN THE INFO. NONE OF THIS INFO IS GIVEN TO ZHU ON A REGULAR BASIS.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.