37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 481330 |
Time | |
Date | 200008 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
State Reference | FO |
Altitude | msl single value : 33000 |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zny.artcc |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B767 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | other other other |
Flight Phase | cruise : level |
Route In Use | enroute : atlantic |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zny.artcc |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B767 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | other other other |
Flight Phase | cruise : level |
Route In Use | enroute : atlantic |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | government : faa |
Function | controller : non radar |
Qualification | controller : radar |
Experience | controller non radar : 10 controller radar : 10 controller time certified in position1 : 5 |
ASRS Report | 481330 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne critical non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 27000 vertical : 0 |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Facility Chart Or Publication |
Primary Problem | ATC Facility |
Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : zny.artcc |
Airspace Structure | class a : zny.a |
Chart | sectional : oceanic |
Publication | noar |
Narrative:
An extremely unsafe situation occurs and is tolerated by ZNY on a daily basis. The only way to determine whether 2 aircraft navigating over the ocean are on reciprocal or crossing courses is to plot them out on a map provided by the FAA which is inaccurate and not printed nor certified by NOAA, and bend a flight progress strip to try to obtain an approximately 45 degree angle. Despite requests made by ATC controllers and ucr, the FAA has not acted on the problem, however, they do acknowledge that a problem is present. Since our requests for more appropriate tools have fallen on deaf ears (both washington headquarters as well as ZNY) and with this latest loss of separation, it is that I desperately ask for your help in attempting to rectify this situation that compromises the safety of the flying public before a midair collision occurs as a result of this operating practice. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following information: reporter stated a controller chart is being used by the ZNY oceanic area to plot aircraft. He said the chart is at least 5 1/2 yrs old and does not have a scale. He stated most controllers know 1 degree is 60 mi and use that system to determine separation. Over the yrs, he said revisions to the chart are cut and pasted on, adding to the inaccuracy of the chart. The facility does not have a cartographer so the maps are not replaced very often. He said while he was working oceanic, separation was lost between 2 B767 aircraft that came within 45 mi of each other at FL330. He told the board at the operational error hearing that the controller charts were unreliable. He is still waiting for a response to a ucr he filed on the chart problem approximately 1 1/2 yrs ago.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A LOSS OF SEPARATION OCCURRED IN OCEANIC AIRSPACE. ZNY ARTCC CTLR CLAIMS OCEANIC CTLRS ARE USING MAPS THAT ARE INACCURATE AND UNCERTIFIED BY NOAA.
Narrative: AN EXTREMELY UNSAFE SIT OCCURS AND IS TOLERATED BY ZNY ON A DAILY BASIS. THE ONLY WAY TO DETERMINE WHETHER 2 ACFT NAVING OVER THE OCEAN ARE ON RECIPROCAL OR XING COURSES IS TO PLOT THEM OUT ON A MAP PROVIDED BY THE FAA WHICH IS INACCURATE AND NOT PRINTED NOR CERTIFIED BY NOAA, AND BEND A FLT PROGRESS STRIP TO TRY TO OBTAIN AN APPROX 45 DEG ANGLE. DESPITE REQUESTS MADE BY ATC CTLRS AND UCR, THE FAA HAS NOT ACTED ON THE PROB, HOWEVER, THEY DO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT A PROB IS PRESENT. SINCE OUR REQUESTS FOR MORE APPROPRIATE TOOLS HAVE FALLEN ON DEAF EARS (BOTH WASHINGTON HEADQUARTERS AS WELL AS ZNY) AND WITH THIS LATEST LOSS OF SEPARATION, IT IS THAT I DESPERATELY ASK FOR YOUR HELP IN ATTEMPTING TO RECTIFY THIS SIT THAT COMPROMISES THE SAFETY OF THE FLYING PUBLIC BEFORE A MIDAIR COLLISION OCCURS AS A RESULT OF THIS OPERATING PRACTICE. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: RPTR STATED A CTLR CHART IS BEING USED BY THE ZNY OCEANIC AREA TO PLOT ACFT. HE SAID THE CHART IS AT LEAST 5 1/2 YRS OLD AND DOES NOT HAVE A SCALE. HE STATED MOST CTLRS KNOW 1 DEG IS 60 MI AND USE THAT SYS TO DETERMINE SEPARATION. OVER THE YRS, HE SAID REVISIONS TO THE CHART ARE CUT AND PASTED ON, ADDING TO THE INACCURACY OF THE CHART. THE FACILITY DOES NOT HAVE A CARTOGRAPHER SO THE MAPS ARE NOT REPLACED VERY OFTEN. HE SAID WHILE HE WAS WORKING OCEANIC, SEPARATION WAS LOST BTWN 2 B767 ACFT THAT CAME WITHIN 45 MI OF EACH OTHER AT FL330. HE TOLD THE BOARD AT THE OPERROR HEARING THAT THE CTLR CHARTS WERE UNRELIABLE. HE IS STILL WAITING FOR A RESPONSE TO A UCR HE FILED ON THE CHART PROB APPROX 1 1/2 YRS AGO.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.