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37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
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A B757 captain reported that, while on the civet into lax, he received a TA for a DC8 which would have developed into an RA had an ATC supervisor not cut into the frequency and turned him away from the DC8.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 482450 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200008 |
| Day | Sat |
| Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : sct.tracon |
| State Reference | CA |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 13000 msl bound upper : 13500 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : sct.tracon |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | B757 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Navigation In Use | other |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach |
| Route In Use | arrival star : civet 4 |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : sct.tracon |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | DC-8 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | descent : approach |
| Route In Use | arrival star : civet 4 |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| ASRS Report | 482450 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : commercial pilot : instrument |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : published procedure non adherence : required legal separation other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | aircraft equipment : tcas other controllera |
| Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance controller : separated traffic |
| Consequence | other |
| Miss Distance | horizontal : 12000 vertical : 0 |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance |
| Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
| Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error |
Narrative:
On arrival into lax, we had been cleared to cross civet below 17000 ft and cleared for the civet 4 arrival. We had passed civet, proceeding to bremr, with 12000 ft set in altitude window. Descending through 13500 ft (approximately), we got a TCASII TA alert. I checked the TCASII scope and saw an aircraft about our same altitude. I looked out left window and saw a DC8 flying toward us at about 3 mi. DC8 started a turn to his left then rolled out on a heading to intercept civet arrival about bremr, still on conflicting course with us. Controller issued instruction for us to turn to a 220 degree heading, which would have turned us into him. By now we're at 13000 ft and shallowing our rate of descent. I elected not to turn to 220 degrees and about that time a different controller came on and instructed us to turn to a heading of 320 degrees and maintain 13000 ft, which took us away from the conflict. We were vectored back to rejoin the lax runway 25L localizer and landed without incident. We estimate our closest distance at 2 mi and got no TCASII RA.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A B757 CAPT RPTED THAT, WHILE ON THE CIVET INTO LAX, HE RECEIVED A TA FOR A DC8 WHICH WOULD HAVE DEVELOPED INTO AN RA HAD AN ATC SUPVR NOT CUT INTO THE FREQ AND TURNED HIM AWAY FROM THE DC8.
Narrative: ON ARR INTO LAX, WE HAD BEEN CLRED TO CROSS CIVET BELOW 17000 FT AND CLRED FOR THE CIVET 4 ARR. WE HAD PASSED CIVET, PROCEEDING TO BREMR, WITH 12000 FT SET IN ALT WINDOW. DSNDING THROUGH 13500 FT (APPROX), WE GOT A TCASII TA ALERT. I CHKED THE TCASII SCOPE AND SAW AN ACFT ABOUT OUR SAME ALT. I LOOKED OUT L WINDOW AND SAW A DC8 FLYING TOWARD US AT ABOUT 3 MI. DC8 STARTED A TURN TO HIS L THEN ROLLED OUT ON A HDG TO INTERCEPT CIVET ARR ABOUT BREMR, STILL ON CONFLICTING COURSE WITH US. CTLR ISSUED INSTRUCTION FOR US TO TURN TO A 220 DEG HDG, WHICH WOULD HAVE TURNED US INTO HIM. BY NOW WE'RE AT 13000 FT AND SHALLOWING OUR RATE OF DSCNT. I ELECTED NOT TO TURN TO 220 DEGS AND ABOUT THAT TIME A DIFFERENT CTLR CAME ON AND INSTRUCTED US TO TURN TO A HDG OF 320 DEGS AND MAINTAIN 13000 FT, WHICH TOOK US AWAY FROM THE CONFLICT. WE WERE VECTORED BACK TO REJOIN THE LAX RWY 25L LOC AND LANDED WITHOUT INCIDENT. WE ESTIMATE OUR CLOSEST DISTANCE AT 2 MI AND GOT NO TCASII RA.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.