 |
37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
ZTL controller questions supervisor about united states forest service tfr and potential traffic conflicts due to military training route ir-726 usage.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 490770 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200011 |
| Day | Wed |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | navaid : hmv.vortac |
| State Reference | NC |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 2700 msl bound upper : 8000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : ztl.artcc tracon : zzz.tracon |
| Operator | other |
| Make Model Name | Eagle (F-15) |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Navigation In Use | other |
| Flight Phase | cruise : enroute altitude change cruise : level |
| Route In Use | enroute other |
| Flight Plan | IFR Combined VFR |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : ztl.artcc |
| Operator | other |
| Make Model Name | Other |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
| Flight Phase | cruise : enroute altitude change |
| Route In Use | enroute other |
| Flight Plan | VFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | government : faa |
| Function | controller : radar |
| Qualification | pilot : private |
| Experience | controller radar : 19 flight time total : 10 |
| ASRS Report | 490770 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | government : faa |
| Function | controller : supervisor |
| Qualification | controller : radar |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | airspace violation : entry conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : published procedure non adherence : required legal separation |
| Independent Detector | other controllera |
| Resolutory Action | controller : separated traffic controller : issued new clearance |
| Consequence | faa : investigated |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | FAA ATC Human Performance Airspace Structure |
| Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
| Air Traffic Incident | Inter Facility Coordination Failure Operational Deviation Intra Facility Coordination Failure |
| Situations | |
| ATC Facility | procedure or policy : ztl.artcc |
Narrative:
A tfr was issued near 5a3, 5 NM radius of 3554.9N/8154.2W and the HMV145025. Latitude/longitude is at MHV162033. The wording was confusing. For 2 days, I thought it was 1 tfr at HMV145025. I mentioned to 2 different supervisors that I was observing aircraft on 1255 (fire fighting beacon code) well outside the tfr. Today, I started checking on the latitude/longitude. It was near the MHV162033, well away from the HMV145025. So now I think there are 2 tfr's. Again, I mentioned this to the supervisor. He contacted the forest service. They said they only have 1. No resolution to the confusion was provided. There is no telling how many airplanes we've run through the HMV162033 area. IR726 conflicts with both areas. We figured out if we could cross point F at 8000 ft, we would clear the tfr's. 1 aircraft was successfully handled this way. 2 F-15's were later cleared in with same restr. I observed the F15's very close to the tfr's at 2700 ft, contacted them and told them to climb. They were well past point F. The tfr was for 7000 ft and below.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ZTL CTLR QUESTIONS SUPVR ABOUT UNITED STATES FOREST SVC TFR AND POTENTIAL TFC CONFLICTS DUE TO MIL TRAINING RTE IR-726 USAGE.
Narrative: A TFR WAS ISSUED NEAR 5A3, 5 NM RADIUS OF 3554.9N/8154.2W AND THE HMV145025. LATITUDE/LONGITUDE IS AT MHV162033. THE WORDING WAS CONFUSING. FOR 2 DAYS, I THOUGHT IT WAS 1 TFR AT HMV145025. I MENTIONED TO 2 DIFFERENT SUPVRS THAT I WAS OBSERVING ACFT ON 1255 (FIRE FIGHTING BEACON CODE) WELL OUTSIDE THE TFR. TODAY, I STARTED CHKING ON THE LATITUDE/LONGITUDE. IT WAS NEAR THE MHV162033, WELL AWAY FROM THE HMV145025. SO NOW I THINK THERE ARE 2 TFR'S. AGAIN, I MENTIONED THIS TO THE SUPVR. HE CONTACTED THE FOREST SVC. THEY SAID THEY ONLY HAVE 1. NO RESOLUTION TO THE CONFUSION WAS PROVIDED. THERE IS NO TELLING HOW MANY AIRPLANES WE'VE RUN THROUGH THE HMV162033 AREA. IR726 CONFLICTS WITH BOTH AREAS. WE FIGURED OUT IF WE COULD CROSS POINT F AT 8000 FT, WE WOULD CLR THE TFR'S. 1 ACFT WAS SUCCESSFULLY HANDLED THIS WAY. 2 F-15'S WERE LATER CLRED IN WITH SAME RESTR. I OBSERVED THE F15'S VERY CLOSE TO THE TFR'S AT 2700 FT, CONTACTED THEM AND TOLD THEM TO CLB. THEY WERE WELL PAST POINT F. THE TFR WAS FOR 7000 FT AND BELOW.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.