37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 561222 |
Time | |
Date | 200209 |
Day | Sat |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : las.airport |
State Reference | NV |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Dawn |
Aircraft 1 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B757-200 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | climbout : initial |
Route In Use | departure sid : aaces 1 rnav |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 18000 flight time type : 500 |
ASRS Report | 561222 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : clearance other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | other |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Our company issued a NOTAM to not accept RNAV departures till further advised. Before departure from las, captain and myself discussed NOTAM and noted our company flight plan was filed using the las 1 departure (non RNAV) and entered same in the FMC. Because pre departure clearance was not available, I called clearance delivery and was issued 'cleared to phl via aaces 1 (RNAV) to dvc a/F maintain 7000 ft departure frequency 125.9, squawk XXXX.' I thought I read back 'las 1 dvc etc' and asked controller to confirm readback. Controller said 'readback correct.' in the future, when pre departure clearance is not available, I will turn speaker on and have captain monitor the clearance and readback! No conflicts occurred. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following information: the reporter's company has decided that since there is a restr that requires the updating of the 'navigation system at a known location within 30 mins prior to takeoff' that their crews may not accept the RNAV departures until there is a location printed on the chart that they can use as a reference to use at the end of the runway. The crew became concerned when a vector heading was not offered after a reasonable delay on runway heading and they were beginning to diverge from the assigned course as indicated on the las 1 departure. The departure controller seemed unconcerned about the track until queried by the crew. At that point the displacement from the aaces RNAV 1 departure track was estimated to be 2 1/2 - 3 mi.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A TRACK DEV AT LAX, NV, WHEN THE FILED AND READBACK DEP WAS NOT WHAT THE CTLR THOUGHT WAS BEING FLOWN.
Narrative: OUR COMPANY ISSUED A NOTAM TO NOT ACCEPT RNAV DEPS TILL FURTHER ADVISED. BEFORE DEP FROM LAS, CAPT AND MYSELF DISCUSSED NOTAM AND NOTED OUR COMPANY FLT PLAN WAS FILED USING THE LAS 1 DEP (NON RNAV) AND ENTERED SAME IN THE FMC. BECAUSE PDC WAS NOT AVAILABLE, I CALLED CLRNC DELIVERY AND WAS ISSUED 'CLRED TO PHL VIA AACES 1 (RNAV) TO DVC A/F MAINTAIN 7000 FT DEP FREQ 125.9, SQUAWK XXXX.' I THOUGHT I READ BACK 'LAS 1 DVC ETC' AND ASKED CTLR TO CONFIRM READBACK. CTLR SAID 'READBACK CORRECT.' IN THE FUTURE, WHEN PDC IS NOT AVAILABLE, I WILL TURN SPEAKER ON AND HAVE CAPT MONITOR THE CLRNC AND READBACK! NO CONFLICTS OCCURRED. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: THE RPTR'S COMPANY HAS DECIDED THAT SINCE THERE IS A RESTR THAT REQUIRES THE UPDATING OF THE 'NAV SYS AT A KNOWN LOCATION WITHIN 30 MINS PRIOR TO TKOF' THAT THEIR CREWS MAY NOT ACCEPT THE RNAV DEPS UNTIL THERE IS A LOCATION PRINTED ON THE CHART THAT THEY CAN USE AS A REF TO USE AT THE END OF THE RWY. THE CREW BECAME CONCERNED WHEN A VECTOR HDG WAS NOT OFFERED AFTER A REASONABLE DELAY ON RWY HDG AND THEY WERE BEGINNING TO DIVERGE FROM THE ASSIGNED COURSE AS INDICATED ON THE LAS 1 DEP. THE DEP CTLR SEEMED UNCONCERNED ABOUT THE TRACK UNTIL QUERIED BY THE CREW. AT THAT POINT THE DISPLACEMENT FROM THE AACES RNAV 1 DEP TRACK WAS ESTIMATED TO BE 2 1/2 - 3 MI.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.