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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 588091 |
Time | |
Date | 200307 |
Day | Mon |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : sct.tracon |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl single value : 9500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Dusk |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : sct.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B737-700 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | ils localizer & glide slope : 24r |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Route In Use | approach : instrument precision arrival star : paradise 4 |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : sct.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B757 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 160 flight time total : 11000 flight time type : 7000 |
ASRS Report | 588091 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : instrument pilot : multi engine |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 16800 flight time type : 4800 |
ASRS Report | 588095 |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne critical non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment : tcas other controllera other flight crewa other flight crewb |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued advisory controller : issued new clearance flight crew : took evasive action |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew faa : investigated |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 2500 vertical : 400 |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Flight Crew Human Performance |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Narrative:
On the paradise four arrival (RNAV), we were cleared to 'descent via the POZ4 arrival to runway 24R.' approaching mitts, socal pointed out aircraft Y traffic 1 O'clock position for about 2 mi and that he had us in sight. We responded that we had him in sight. He was not on our frequency. We were slowing converging and carefully watching him visually and on TCASII. He was almost 1000 ft higher and I thought perhaps he was on a vector to join final for runway 25L or right. As we reached mitts at 10000 ft MSL, we expeditiously reset our altitude to 8000 ft for denay and pushed over, since the B757 was now only about 800 ft above our altitude. During this time, I was anxious for a chance to query socal about their intentions for the B757, but could not because the frequency was continuously busy for at least a full min as we converged. I pushed identify on our transponder as we pushed over out of 10000 ft MSL. The B757 evidently increased his descent route because we next got an RA to descend with vertical spacing approximately 400 ft and about 1/2 mi horizontal spacing. At this point, it was obvious the B757 was going to the same localizer runway 24R. Before we had a chance to call them, socal issued us a left turn to 180 degrees and descent clearance to 4000 ft. With our acknowledgement, we informed them of our RA descent. Socal said air carrier Y had relayed his RA climb and some words about aircraft Y 'not being too happy.' I elected to ask for a telephone number for socal, which I think is more professional. Socal promised a telephone number 'prior to landing.' about 30 seconds later, socal reclred us to intercept localizer runway 25L and apologized for any confusion, intimated that the conflict was their mistake, and promised a telephone number from ground control. Landed runway 25L uneventfully. At the gate, I called the manager ATC system. He wanted to call socal first, so I did not. He called me back about 10 mins later saying socal had listened to the tapes. We did nothing wrong, and socal apologized for 'mis-speaking' our runway assignment on our initial clearance while on the PDZ4. They had intended to put us on runway 25L. We were never on the same frequency as aircraft Y.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B737 ON FINAL FOR LAX EXPERIENCED RA WITH B757, CTLR ERROR.
Narrative: ON THE PARADISE FOUR ARR (RNAV), WE WERE CLRED TO 'DSCNT VIA THE POZ4 ARR TO RWY 24R.' APCHING MITTS, SOCAL POINTED OUT ACFT Y TFC 1 O'CLOCK POS FOR ABOUT 2 MI AND THAT HE HAD US IN SIGHT. WE RESPONDED THAT WE HAD HIM IN SIGHT. HE WAS NOT ON OUR FREQ. WE WERE SLOWING CONVERGING AND CAREFULLY WATCHING HIM VISUALLY AND ON TCASII. HE WAS ALMOST 1000 FT HIGHER AND I THOUGHT PERHAPS HE WAS ON A VECTOR TO JOIN FINAL FOR RWY 25L OR R. AS WE REACHED MITTS AT 10000 FT MSL, WE EXPEDITIOUSLY RESET OUR ALT TO 8000 FT FOR DENAY AND PUSHED OVER, SINCE THE B757 WAS NOW ONLY ABOUT 800 FT ABOVE OUR ALT. DURING THIS TIME, I WAS ANXIOUS FOR A CHANCE TO QUERY SOCAL ABOUT THEIR INTENTIONS FOR THE B757, BUT COULD NOT BECAUSE THE FREQ WAS CONTINUOUSLY BUSY FOR AT LEAST A FULL MIN AS WE CONVERGED. I PUSHED IDENT ON OUR XPONDER AS WE PUSHED OVER OUT OF 10000 FT MSL. THE B757 EVIDENTLY INCREASED HIS DSCNT RTE BECAUSE WE NEXT GOT AN RA TO DSND WITH VERT SPACING APPROX 400 FT AND ABOUT 1/2 MI HORIZ SPACING. AT THIS POINT, IT WAS OBVIOUS THE B757 WAS GOING TO THE SAME LOC RWY 24R. BEFORE WE HAD A CHANCE TO CALL THEM, SOCAL ISSUED US A L TURN TO 180 DEGS AND DSCNT CLRNC TO 4000 FT. WITH OUR ACKNOWLEDGEMENT, WE INFORMED THEM OF OUR RA DSCNT. SOCAL SAID ACR Y HAD RELAYED HIS RA CLB AND SOME WORDS ABOUT ACFT Y 'NOT BEING TOO HAPPY.' I ELECTED TO ASK FOR A TELEPHONE NUMBER FOR SOCAL, WHICH I THINK IS MORE PROFESSIONAL. SOCAL PROMISED A TELEPHONE NUMBER 'PRIOR TO LNDG.' ABOUT 30 SECONDS LATER, SOCAL RECLRED US TO INTERCEPT LOC RWY 25L AND APOLOGIZED FOR ANY CONFUSION, INTIMATED THAT THE CONFLICT WAS THEIR MISTAKE, AND PROMISED A TELEPHONE NUMBER FROM GND CTL. LANDED RWY 25L UNEVENTFULLY. AT THE GATE, I CALLED THE MGR ATC SYS. HE WANTED TO CALL SOCAL FIRST, SO I DID NOT. HE CALLED ME BACK ABOUT 10 MINS LATER SAYING SOCAL HAD LISTENED TO THE TAPES. WE DID NOTHING WRONG, AND SOCAL APOLOGIZED FOR 'MIS-SPEAKING' OUR RWY ASSIGNMENT ON OUR INITIAL CLRNC WHILE ON THE PDZ4. THEY HAD INTENDED TO PUT US ON RWY 25L. WE WERE NEVER ON THE SAME FREQ AS ACFT Y.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.