P31 controller expressed concern regarding npa gca controller's unwillingness to accept a flight for...

Attributes
ACN	601694
Time
Date	200312
Day	Thu
Local Time Of Day	1201 To 1800
Place
Locale Reference	navaid : npa.vortac
State Reference	FL
Altitude	msl single value : 1500
Environment
Flight Conditions	IMC
Weather Elements	Fog
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : p31.tracon tower : npa.tower
Operator	other
Make Model Name	Hornet (F-18)
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 91
Flight Phase	descent : intermediate altitude descent : holding descent : approach
Route In Use	approach : visual
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	government : faa
Function	controller : approach
Qualification	controller : radar
Experience	controller time certified in position1 : 9.5
ASRS Report	601694
Person 2
Affiliation	government : faa
Function	controller : supervisor
Experience	controller military : 8 controller non radar : 2 controller radar : 33 controller supervisory : 14 controller time certified in position1 : 12 controller time certified in position2 : 5 flight time total : 30
ASRS Report	601691
Events
Anomaly	inflight encounter : weather other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other controllera other controllerb
Resolutory Action	controller : issued new clearance flight crew : declared emergency
Consequence	faa : reviewed incident with flight crew
Supplementary
Problem Areas	ATC Human Performance Company Weather
Primary Problem	ATC Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	Inter Facility Coordination Failure

Narrative:

Npa was reporting 2000 ft scattered, but had just called and advised that they would not accept and break overhead traffic. I had a flight of 2 F-18's inbound from the west requesting a visual straight-in approach. I asked npa ATCT if they thought that the F-18's could get in on a straight-in visual and the tower said yes. I descended them to 1500 ft (MVA), but they did not pick up the field until approximately 3 mi out, and they requested to be broken out and vectored for a sectioned PAR approach. I told npa what they were going to do and vectored them out for the PAR npa, then called over and said their ceiling was now 700 ft broken. I vectored the F-18's out, turned them to final, and when handing them off to gca, I advised that they wanted a sectioned PAR. Gca said unable sectioned approach due to WX, and that I would have to split them up. I broke out the 2 aircraft again and told them. The lead pilot said they would not split up and requested vectors for a TACAN runway 7R approach. I vectored them back out (as a flight) and cleared them for the approach. I again handed them off to gca for final monitor (in accordance with local LOA). Gca called and said the ceiling was now 200 ft or 300 ft broken, that the flight could not execute the approach and to break them out and split them up. Pilot said he would not split up and wanted to continue the approach. Our supervisor called npa gca, advised he was declaring an emergency for the flight, and they were doing the TACAN approach. Fly continued and landed without incident. We never received official npa WX until after all this happened. They were still showing 2000 ft scattered. After they landed, he called us and thanked us and told us his wing man did not have the same rating and that is why he would not split him off. If the pilot wanted to shoot the approach, then npa gca should not have tried to deny it. The lack of timely, accurate WX and the increase coordination required created an unsafe situation for both aircraft as well as the other aircraft I was working on final at the time.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: P31 CTLR EXPRESSED CONCERN REGARDING NPA GCA CTLR'S UNWILLINGNESS TO ACCEPT A FLT FOR GCA OR TACAN APCH WITH DECREASING WX CONDITIONS.

Narrative: NPA WAS RPTING 2000 FT SCATTERED, BUT HAD JUST CALLED AND ADVISED THAT THEY WOULD NOT ACCEPT AND BREAK OVERHEAD TFC. I HAD A FLT OF 2 F-18'S INBOUND FROM THE W REQUESTING A VISUAL STRAIGHT-IN APCH. I ASKED NPA ATCT IF THEY THOUGHT THAT THE F-18'S COULD GET IN ON A STRAIGHT-IN VISUAL AND THE TWR SAID YES. I DSNDED THEM TO 1500 FT (MVA), BUT THEY DID NOT PICK UP THE FIELD UNTIL APPROX 3 MI OUT, AND THEY REQUESTED TO BE BROKEN OUT AND VECTORED FOR A SECTIONED PAR APCH. I TOLD NPA WHAT THEY WERE GOING TO DO AND VECTORED THEM OUT FOR THE PAR NPA, THEN CALLED OVER AND SAID THEIR CEILING WAS NOW 700 FT BROKEN. I VECTORED THE F-18'S OUT, TURNED THEM TO FINAL, AND WHEN HANDING THEM OFF TO GCA, I ADVISED THAT THEY WANTED A SECTIONED PAR. GCA SAID UNABLE SECTIONED APCH DUE TO WX, AND THAT I WOULD HAVE TO SPLIT THEM UP. I BROKE OUT THE 2 ACFT AGAIN AND TOLD THEM. THE LEAD PLT SAID THEY WOULD NOT SPLIT UP AND REQUESTED VECTORS FOR A TACAN RWY 7R APCH. I VECTORED THEM BACK OUT (AS A FLT) AND CLRED THEM FOR THE APCH. I AGAIN HANDED THEM OFF TO GCA FOR FINAL MONITOR (IN ACCORDANCE WITH LCL LOA). GCA CALLED AND SAID THE CEILING WAS NOW 200 FT OR 300 FT BROKEN, THAT THE FLT COULD NOT EXECUTE THE APCH AND TO BREAK THEM OUT AND SPLIT THEM UP. PLT SAID HE WOULD NOT SPLIT UP AND WANTED TO CONTINUE THE APCH. OUR SUPVR CALLED NPA GCA, ADVISED HE WAS DECLARING AN EMER FOR THE FLT, AND THEY WERE DOING THE TACAN APCH. FLY CONTINUED AND LANDED WITHOUT INCIDENT. WE NEVER RECEIVED OFFICIAL NPA WX UNTIL AFTER ALL THIS HAPPENED. THEY WERE STILL SHOWING 2000 FT SCATTERED. AFTER THEY LANDED, HE CALLED US AND THANKED US AND TOLD US HIS WING MAN DID NOT HAVE THE SAME RATING AND THAT IS WHY HE WOULD NOT SPLIT HIM OFF. IF THE PLT WANTED TO SHOOT THE APCH, THEN NPA GCA SHOULD NOT HAVE TRIED TO DENY IT. THE LACK OF TIMELY, ACCURATE WX AND THE INCREASE COORD REQUIRED CREATED AN UNSAFE SIT FOR BOTH ACFT AS WELL AS THE OTHER ACFT I WAS WORKING ON FINAL AT THE TIME.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.

P31 controller expressed concern regarding npa gca controller's unwillingness to accept a flight for gca or TACAN approach with decreasing WX conditions.