Narrative:

This was a line training flight (IOE) for a new first officer. I flew the first leg; then flew back up to sjc. Since it is virtually impossible to tell where the lax class B airspace boundaries are while flying into sna from the north; my personal procedure is to slow to 210 KTS indicated when descending towards the sxc VOR sbound. I developed this personal procedure to keep from having to deal with trying to monitor aircraft position relative to class B airspace while entering an area of extremely heavy VFR traffic. This area of california has already had 2 airliners collide with small VFR/IFR aircraft killing hundreds of people. I do not intend to be the next one to suffer that fate. It is far more important to be looking for VFR traffic than to be wondering where an imaginary line in space might be. During the first leg; VFR traffic was what I would describe as 'light.' on our return; the first officer was at the controls. We were descending into sxc when we were turned to the ene on a vector. This was followed by several TA's which diverted our attention outside the aircraft. Air traffic was now what I would call heavy. We were given 2 TA's. Upon leveling at 5000 ft; we were turned further to the northeast and unknown VFR traffic was called out off to our right side -- type and altitude unknown -- no transponder. We searched for this traffic without success. This was followed by another call for another unknown VFR traffic; again; type and altitude unknown -- no transponder. We searched for this traffic. Next we were advised of two more traffic targets that were transponder equipped. At this point the first officer queried me as to what his speed should be. I noticed we were indicating about 230 KTS. Since my attention was diverted (trying to avoid being killed in a midair collision) and since we had been on a vector for quite some time; I had no idea what our position was relative to the class B airspace. I looked out towards sna; looked to the left towards lgb and tried to visually fix our location. Both navigation radios were tuned to the sna ILS runway 19R frequency. Before I could get an answer out the 'socal' controller called and advised us to 'check your speed; you are below the class B.' we immediately slowed the aircraft 200 KTS indicated. The flight proceeded normally to sna. By far the easiest thing to do is put the class B boundaries on the arrival charts. This will do 2 things: 1) it will remind pilots who have not flown in there in the last 6-12 months; or who might never have flown into sna; that there is a danger you will be below class B airspace; and 2) it will enable the pilot quickly fix his/her position relative to the class B boundaries. As a minimum; the tandy arrival chart should have a big box on it stating that this arrival (or whatever arrival it is) operates below class B airspace. In addition; I'll have to be more cognizant with briefings with my first officer's about the arrival into this area; and; in general; include a detailed briefing of the 10-7 page for any reminders that might be included there. Supplemental information from acn 709698: this was my first line training flight as the first officer. The captain had flown the first leg into sna and I noticed that he had slowed to 210 KTS about 15 mi from sna. So when I flew the next leg to sna I asked him what our speed should be about 15 mi from sna. Before he could respond to my question the controller told us to check our speed and that we were below class B airspace. Just before telling us to check our speed the controller had informed us of 2 VFR traffic conflicts without xponders as well as a couple of transponder equipped aircraft that we were looking for. After the speed call we immediately slowed to 200 KTS. I have not flown into sna enough to really have any good suggestions.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: A B737-700 ON DSCNT INTO SNA EXCEEDS 200 KT RESTR BELOW FLOOR OF CLASS B AIRSPACE.

Narrative: THIS WAS A LINE TRAINING FLT (IOE) FOR A NEW FO. I FLEW THE FIRST LEG; THEN FLEW BACK UP TO SJC. SINCE IT IS VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE TO TELL WHERE THE LAX CLASS B AIRSPACE BOUNDARIES ARE WHILE FLYING INTO SNA FROM THE N; MY PERSONAL PROC IS TO SLOW TO 210 KTS INDICATED WHEN DSNDING TOWARDS THE SXC VOR SBOUND. I DEVELOPED THIS PERSONAL PROC TO KEEP FROM HAVING TO DEAL WITH TRYING TO MONITOR ACFT POS RELATIVE TO CLASS B AIRSPACE WHILE ENTERING AN AREA OF EXTREMELY HVY VFR TFC. THIS AREA OF CALIFORNIA HAS ALREADY HAD 2 AIRLINERS COLLIDE WITH SMALL VFR/IFR ACFT KILLING HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE. I DO NOT INTEND TO BE THE NEXT ONE TO SUFFER THAT FATE. IT IS FAR MORE IMPORTANT TO BE LOOKING FOR VFR TFC THAN TO BE WONDERING WHERE AN IMAGINARY LINE IN SPACE MIGHT BE. DURING THE FIRST LEG; VFR TFC WAS WHAT I WOULD DESCRIBE AS 'LIGHT.' ON OUR RETURN; THE FO WAS AT THE CTLS. WE WERE DSNDING INTO SXC WHEN WE WERE TURNED TO THE ENE ON A VECTOR. THIS WAS FOLLOWED BY SEVERAL TA'S WHICH DIVERTED OUR ATTN OUTSIDE THE ACFT. AIR TFC WAS NOW WHAT I WOULD CALL HVY. WE WERE GIVEN 2 TA'S. UPON LEVELING AT 5000 FT; WE WERE TURNED FURTHER TO THE NE AND UNKNOWN VFR TFC WAS CALLED OUT OFF TO OUR R SIDE -- TYPE AND ALT UNKNOWN -- NO XPONDER. WE SEARCHED FOR THIS TFC WITHOUT SUCCESS. THIS WAS FOLLOWED BY ANOTHER CALL FOR ANOTHER UNKNOWN VFR TFC; AGAIN; TYPE AND ALT UNKNOWN -- NO XPONDER. WE SEARCHED FOR THIS TFC. NEXT WE WERE ADVISED OF TWO MORE TRAFFIC TARGETS THAT WERE XPONDER EQUIPPED. AT THIS POINT THE FO QUERIED ME AS TO WHAT HIS SPD SHOULD BE. I NOTICED WE WERE INDICATING ABOUT 230 KTS. SINCE MY ATTN WAS DIVERTED (TRYING TO AVOID BEING KILLED IN A MIDAIR COLLISION) AND SINCE WE HAD BEEN ON A VECTOR FOR QUITE SOME TIME; I HAD NO IDEA WHAT OUR POS WAS RELATIVE TO THE CLASS B AIRSPACE. I LOOKED OUT TOWARDS SNA; LOOKED TO THE L TOWARDS LGB AND TRIED TO VISUALLY FIX OUR LOCATION. BOTH NAV RADIOS WERE TUNED TO THE SNA ILS RWY 19R FREQ. BEFORE I COULD GET AN ANSWER OUT THE 'SOCAL' CTLR CALLED AND ADVISED US TO 'CHK YOUR SPD; YOU ARE BELOW THE CLASS B.' WE IMMEDIATELY SLOWED THE ACFT 200 KTS INDICATED. THE FLT PROCEEDED NORMALLY TO SNA. BY FAR THE EASIEST THING TO DO IS PUT THE CLASS B BOUNDARIES ON THE ARR CHARTS. THIS WILL DO 2 THINGS: 1) IT WILL REMIND PLTS WHO HAVE NOT FLOWN IN THERE IN THE LAST 6-12 MONTHS; OR WHO MIGHT NEVER HAVE FLOWN INTO SNA; THAT THERE IS A DANGER YOU WILL BE BELOW CLASS B AIRSPACE; AND 2) IT WILL ENABLE THE PLT QUICKLY FIX HIS/HER POS RELATIVE TO THE CLASS B BOUNDARIES. AS A MINIMUM; THE TANDY ARR CHART SHOULD HAVE A BIG BOX ON IT STATING THAT THIS ARR (OR WHATEVER ARR IT IS) OPERATES BELOW CLASS B AIRSPACE. IN ADDITION; I'LL HAVE TO BE MORE COGNIZANT WITH BRIEFINGS WITH MY FO'S ABOUT THE ARR INTO THIS AREA; AND; IN GENERAL; INCLUDE A DETAILED BRIEFING OF THE 10-7 PAGE FOR ANY REMINDERS THAT MIGHT BE INCLUDED THERE. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 709698: THIS WAS MY FIRST LINE TRAINING FLT AS THE FO. THE CAPT HAD FLOWN THE FIRST LEG INTO SNA AND I NOTICED THAT HE HAD SLOWED TO 210 KTS ABOUT 15 MI FROM SNA. SO WHEN I FLEW THE NEXT LEG TO SNA I ASKED HIM WHAT OUR SPD SHOULD BE ABOUT 15 MI FROM SNA. BEFORE HE COULD RESPOND TO MY QUESTION THE CTLR TOLD US TO CHK OUR SPD AND THAT WE WERE BELOW CLASS B AIRSPACE. JUST BEFORE TELLING US TO CHK OUR SPD THE CTLR HAD INFORMED US OF 2 VFR TFC CONFLICTS WITHOUT XPONDERS AS WELL AS A COUPLE OF XPONDER EQUIPPED ACFT THAT WE WERE LOOKING FOR. AFTER THE SPD CALL WE IMMEDIATELY SLOWED TO 200 KTS. I HAVE NOT FLOWN INTO SNA ENOUGH TO REALLY HAVE ANY GOOD SUGGESTIONS.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.