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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 754052 |
Time | |
Date | 200709 |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : mhr.airport |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl single value : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : nct.tracon |
Operator | general aviation : instructional |
Make Model Name | Travelair 95 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | descent : intermediate altitude |
Route In Use | arrival : on vectors |
Flight Plan | None |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : nct.tracon |
Operator | other |
Make Model Name | Talon |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 91 |
Flight Phase | climbout : vacating altitude |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | other |
Function | flight crew : single pilot |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 90 flight time total : 1170 flight time type : 14 |
ASRS Report | 754052 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | other |
Function | instruction : instructor |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : nmac |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa other flight crewb |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : took evasive action |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 200 vertical : 0 |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance Airspace Structure |
Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
Narrative:
We were with norcal approach (127.4) on VFR TA's for practice approachs at mhr. We had been given a discrete code and were in radar contact and given a vector to fly 050 degrees at 3000 ft which put us essentially on a wide downwind for ILS runway 22L at mhr. During this segment of the flight I was on the controls and under the hood. I was taking instruction from another instructor. After we were established on the assigned vector; the approach controller notified us of traffic 'a T-38 in your 5 O'clock position climbing through your altitude and will overtake.' my instructor responded that we were looking for the traffic. Approximately 5 seconds after the call from approach; my instructor told me to lift the hood up and look. At the same time he turned the plane to our right. As I looked out the left window I saw a T-38 within 200 ft of us traveling past us on approximately the same heading we were on and climbing rapidly. The T-38 was traveling well in excess of 200 KIAS. We notified ATC that 'it was too close.' the norcal controller then began a short dialogue with the T-38 pilot but we could not hear all of it because the T-38 was transmitting on UHF. It appeared from the approach controller's words that he thought that the tower at mhr had notified the T-38 of our presence. We were not in the mhr class D airspace. The factors in this incident appeared to be poor communication between the tower controller and the TRACON as well as the T-38 using UHF; we could not hear him and know that he was coming. This appeared to surprise the TRACON controller as his call came warning us only a few seconds before we converged.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: BE95 PLTS ARE CONDUCTING PRACTICE INST APPROACHES WHEN A T38 OVERTAKES; RESULTING IN AN EVASIVE TURN.
Narrative: WE WERE WITH NORCAL APCH (127.4) ON VFR TA'S FOR PRACTICE APCHS AT MHR. WE HAD BEEN GIVEN A DISCRETE CODE AND WERE IN RADAR CONTACT AND GIVEN A VECTOR TO FLY 050 DEGS AT 3000 FT WHICH PUT US ESSENTIALLY ON A WIDE DOWNWIND FOR ILS RWY 22L AT MHR. DURING THIS SEGMENT OF THE FLT I WAS ON THE CTLS AND UNDER THE HOOD. I WAS TAKING INSTRUCTION FROM ANOTHER INSTRUCTOR. AFTER WE WERE ESTABLISHED ON THE ASSIGNED VECTOR; THE APCH CTLR NOTIFIED US OF TFC 'A T-38 IN YOUR 5 O'CLOCK POS CLBING THROUGH YOUR ALT AND WILL OVERTAKE.' MY INSTRUCTOR RESPONDED THAT WE WERE LOOKING FOR THE TFC. APPROX 5 SECONDS AFTER THE CALL FROM APCH; MY INSTRUCTOR TOLD ME TO LIFT THE HOOD UP AND LOOK. AT THE SAME TIME HE TURNED THE PLANE TO OUR R. AS I LOOKED OUT THE L WINDOW I SAW A T-38 WITHIN 200 FT OF US TRAVELING PAST US ON APPROX THE SAME HDG WE WERE ON AND CLBING RAPIDLY. THE T-38 WAS TRAVELING WELL IN EXCESS OF 200 KIAS. WE NOTIFIED ATC THAT 'IT WAS TOO CLOSE.' THE NORCAL CTLR THEN BEGAN A SHORT DIALOGUE WITH THE T-38 PLT BUT WE COULD NOT HEAR ALL OF IT BECAUSE THE T-38 WAS XMITTING ON UHF. IT APPEARED FROM THE APCH CTLR'S WORDS THAT HE THOUGHT THAT THE TWR AT MHR HAD NOTIFIED THE T-38 OF OUR PRESENCE. WE WERE NOT IN THE MHR CLASS D AIRSPACE. THE FACTORS IN THIS INCIDENT APPEARED TO BE POOR COM BTWN THE TWR CTLR AND THE TRACON AS WELL AS THE T-38 USING UHF; WE COULD NOT HEAR HIM AND KNOW THAT HE WAS COMING. THIS APPEARED TO SURPRISE THE TRACON CTLR AS HIS CALL CAME WARNING US ONLY A FEW SECONDS BEFORE WE CONVERGED.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.