Narrative:

Flight was given peble 1 SID from san clearance. On takeoff clearance from tower we were given 'maintain 14000'.' because of previous misunderstandings with ATC I elected to question departure to see if the 8000' restriction crossing the ocn 160 degree right still applied. We were told: 'tower gave you 14000', it doesn't mean anything to me. Maintain the restriction.' we maintained 8000' across the 160 degree right and then departure again told us: 'well we aren't communicating. You should now be climbing to 14000'.' I consider the whole situation to be a classic communications screw up which could have been prevented by the controller's adherence to 7110.65 and that use of standard phraseology. We considered that when the tower told us to maintain 14000' that the 8000' restriction was deleted. When the departure controller said that 14000' meant nothing to him, we were confused as to where tower got the 14000' if not from departure. It appears that many controllers in southern ca are attempting to take out their frustrations at losing air carrier a by 'beating up' on east coast air carrier B crews with 1, 2 or 3 digit flight #'south as opposed to the traditional 4 digit air carrier a numbers that air carrier B is using for calif crews. There also seems to be a lot of 'local understandings' in calif that do not adhere to 7110 or the aim and that many controllers are taking great glee in trying to trip up crews unfamiliar with a lot of these 'local understandings.'

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: ACR MLG FAILED TO FOLLOW SID ALTS.

Narrative: FLT WAS GIVEN PEBLE 1 SID FROM SAN CLRNC. ON TKOF CLRNC FROM TWR WE WERE GIVEN 'MAINTAIN 14000'.' BECAUSE OF PREVIOUS MISUNDERSTANDINGS WITH ATC I ELECTED TO QUESTION DEP TO SEE IF THE 8000' RESTRICTION XING THE OCN 160 DEG R STILL APPLIED. WE WERE TOLD: 'TWR GAVE YOU 14000', IT DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING TO ME. MAINTAIN THE RESTRICTION.' WE MAINTAINED 8000' ACROSS THE 160 DEG R AND THEN DEP AGAIN TOLD US: 'WELL WE AREN'T COMMUNICATING. YOU SHOULD NOW BE CLBING TO 14000'.' I CONSIDER THE WHOLE SITUATION TO BE A CLASSIC COMS SCREW UP WHICH COULD HAVE BEEN PREVENTED BY THE CTLR'S ADHERENCE TO 7110.65 AND THAT USE OF STANDARD PHRASEOLOGY. WE CONSIDERED THAT WHEN THE TWR TOLD US TO MAINTAIN 14000' THAT THE 8000' RESTRICTION WAS DELETED. WHEN THE DEP CTLR SAID THAT 14000' MEANT NOTHING TO HIM, WE WERE CONFUSED AS TO WHERE TWR GOT THE 14000' IF NOT FROM DEP. IT APPEARS THAT MANY CTLRS IN SOUTHERN CA ARE ATTEMPTING TO TAKE OUT THEIR FRUSTRATIONS AT LOSING ACR A BY 'BEATING UP' ON EAST COAST ACR B CREWS WITH 1, 2 OR 3 DIGIT FLT #'S AS OPPOSED TO THE TRADITIONAL 4 DIGIT ACR A NUMBERS THAT ACR B IS USING FOR CALIF CREWS. THERE ALSO SEEMS TO BE A LOT OF 'LCL UNDERSTANDINGS' IN CALIF THAT DO NOT ADHERE TO 7110 OR THE AIM AND THAT MANY CTLRS ARE TAKING GREAT GLEE IN TRYING TO TRIP UP CREWS UNFAMILIAR WITH A LOT OF THESE 'LCL UNDERSTANDINGS.'

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.