<< >> NASA ASRS Report 231737, January 1993

Flight crew on an instrument training flight had an apparent near midair collision with an air carrier aircraft while operating at assigned altitude. Traffic was not given to reporting pilot or to the air carrier aircraft.

Attributes
ACN	231737
Time
Date	199301
Day	Tue
Local Time Of Day	0601 To 1200
Place
Locale Reference	atc facility : pdz airport : pom
State Reference	CA
Altitude	msl bound lower : 5200 msl bound upper : 5200
Environment
Flight Conditions	Mixed
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : ont tower : maf
Operator	general aviation : instructional
Make Model Name	Small Aircraft, Low Wing, 2 Eng, Retractable Gear
Flight Phase	cruise other
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	Other
Function	instruction : instructor
Qualification	pilot : atp pilot : cfi pilot : commercial pilot : instrument
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 2250 flight time type : 40
ASRS Report	231737
Person 2
Affiliation	Other
Function	instruction : trainee
Qualification	pilot : private
Events
Anomaly	conflict : nmac other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	none taken : detected after the fact
Consequence	Other
Miss Distance	horizontal : 300
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Flight Crew Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	Pilot Deviation

Narrative:

Instructor and student in an small aircraft twin engine aircraft on an IFR training flight. We were at 5200 14 NM northwest of pdz VOR, in communication with ontario approach on 125.5, had received a clearance to maintain 5200 and proceed direct pdz. Cloud deck below us at approximately 3200 ft, conditions at altitude: clear. On frequency my student and I heard an airline comment 'boy, that was kind of close!' and then again, 'he was only 3 or 400 ft away from us.' approach's replay was 'roger' and nothing more. I could only feel we were the traffic in question and the carrier was departing ontario airport up through the cloud deck to approximately our area but below us. We never saw the traffic during or after this occurrence (and apparently ontario approach didn't either!). The moral to all this again is, no matter what sort of clearance you have and in VMC or IMC, our responsibility is always 'see and avoid.'

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: FLC ON AN INST TRAINING FLT HAD AN APPARENT NMAC WITH AN ACR ACFT WHILE OPERATING AT ASSIGNED ALT. TFC WAS NOT GIVEN TO RPTING PLT OR TO THE ACR ACFT.

Narrative: INSTRUCTOR AND STUDENT IN AN SMA TWIN ENG ACFT ON AN IFR TRAINING FLT. WE WERE AT 5200 14 NM NW OF PDZ VOR, IN COM WITH ONTARIO APCH ON 125.5, HAD RECEIVED A CLRNC TO MAINTAIN 5200 AND PROCEED DIRECT PDZ. CLOUD DECK BELOW US AT APPROX 3200 FT, CONDITIONS AT ALT: CLR. ON FREQ MY STUDENT AND I HEARD AN AIRLINE COMMENT 'BOY, THAT WAS KIND OF CLOSE!' AND THEN AGAIN, 'HE WAS ONLY 3 OR 400 FT AWAY FROM US.' APCH'S REPLAY WAS 'ROGER' AND NOTHING MORE. I COULD ONLY FEEL WE WERE THE TFC IN QUESTION AND THE CARRIER WAS DEPARTING ONTARIO ARPT UP THROUGH THE CLOUD DECK TO APPROX OUR AREA BUT BELOW US. WE NEVER SAW THE TFC DURING OR AFTER THIS OCCURRENCE (AND APPARENTLY ONTARIO APCH DIDN'T EITHER!). THE MORAL TO ALL THIS AGAIN IS, NO MATTER WHAT SORT OF CLRNC YOU HAVE AND IN VMC OR IMC, OUR RESPONSIBILITY IS ALWAYS 'SEE AND AVOID.'

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.