37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 239095 |
Time | |
Date | 199304 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : pxr airport : phx |
State Reference | AZ |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 12000 msl bound upper : 14000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : edw |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | descent other |
Route In Use | arrival other arrival star : star enroute airway : phx |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 154 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 1000 |
ASRS Report | 239095 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : commercial pilot : instrument |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : crossing restriction not met altitude deviation : undershoot non adherence : clearance other anomaly |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Approaching drake for KARLO5, we were held high by ZLA and given step-downs to FL290. I told copilot to tell center if they gave us the plsnt 12000 ft crossing restriction that we would be unable. After drake, we were handed off to ZAB and at FL290 over or near karlo intersection, told to cross plsnt at 12000 ft. Copilot told them 'unable.' ZAB said they would pass that on to phx approach and to contact phx approach at about coopr intersection. Passing through FL180 at about 340 KIAS, contacted phx approach and told them unable to make restriction at plsnt. Our 'unable's' were hardly acknowledged or modified. Crossed plsnt at about 14000 ft MSL and 330 KIAS. This has always been a problem on this STAR. Too many sectors to cross through starting with ZLA 'passing the buck' through to ZAB then ZAB 'passing the buck' to phx approach who arbitrarily has told ZLA or ZAB ctrs to issue the restriction. If you're going to be a controller, one should know I cannot cross plsnt from drake from FL330 and do it comfortably, especially with a tailwind in excess of 50 KTS. To even expect 280 KIAS at plsnt under these conditions is ridiculous. Give me a break or give me a vector! Or at the very least, acknowledge my 'unable's.'
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: CAPT OF ACR MLG ACFT DID NOT COMPLY WITH A 'STAR' XING RESTRICTION BY UNDERSHOOTING THE ALT AND AT A HIGHER SPD THAN PRESCRIBED.
Narrative: APCHING DRAKE FOR KARLO5, WE WERE HELD HIGH BY ZLA AND GIVEN STEP-DOWNS TO FL290. I TOLD COPLT TO TELL CTR IF THEY GAVE US THE PLSNT 12000 FT XING RESTRICTION THAT WE WOULD BE UNABLE. AFTER DRAKE, WE WERE HANDED OFF TO ZAB AND AT FL290 OVER OR NEAR KARLO INTXN, TOLD TO CROSS PLSNT AT 12000 FT. COPLT TOLD THEM 'UNABLE.' ZAB SAID THEY WOULD PASS THAT ON TO PHX APCH AND TO CONTACT PHX APCH AT ABOUT COOPR INTXN. PASSING THROUGH FL180 AT ABOUT 340 KIAS, CONTACTED PHX APCH AND TOLD THEM UNABLE TO MAKE RESTRICTION AT PLSNT. OUR 'UNABLE'S' WERE HARDLY ACKNOWLEDGED OR MODIFIED. CROSSED PLSNT AT ABOUT 14000 FT MSL AND 330 KIAS. THIS HAS ALWAYS BEEN A PROB ON THIS STAR. TOO MANY SECTORS TO CROSS THROUGH STARTING WITH ZLA 'PASSING THE BUCK' THROUGH TO ZAB THEN ZAB 'PASSING THE BUCK' TO PHX APCH WHO ARBITRARILY HAS TOLD ZLA OR ZAB CTRS TO ISSUE THE RESTRICTION. IF YOU'RE GOING TO BE A CTLR, ONE SHOULD KNOW I CANNOT CROSS PLSNT FROM DRAKE FROM FL330 AND DO IT COMFORTABLY, ESPECIALLY WITH A TAILWIND IN EXCESS OF 50 KTS. TO EVEN EXPECT 280 KIAS AT PLSNT UNDER THESE CONDITIONS IS RIDICULOUS. GIVE ME A BREAK OR GIVE ME A VECTOR! OR AT THE VERY LEAST, ACKNOWLEDGE MY 'UNABLE'S.'
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.