37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 298720 |
Time | |
Date | 199503 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : msp |
State Reference | MN |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 3000 msl bound upper : 4000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Mixed |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : msp |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : flight engineer pilot : instrument pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 186 flight time total : 20770 flight time type : 4097 |
ASRS Report | 298720 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | aircraft equipment problem : less severe altitude deviation : excursion from assigned altitude non adherence : clearance other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : overcame equipment problem flight crew : returned to intended course or assigned course |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Cleared for ILS approach to runway 11R at 5000 ft. Started descent on the GS and at about 4000 ft lost the GS signal. Copilot called approach control and reported loss of GS. I thought I heard cleared to 3000 ft. We discovered after descending below the step down altitude to wayza (4000 ft) that approach control never responded to us. (There apparently was another carrier in the area with a similar call sign). At that point we were VMC and remained at 3000 ft until near kinns. By then the GS had been restored and we reintercepted the GS for an uneventful visual ILS approach and landing. If msp approach control noticed our descent below 4000 ft before wayza they never mentioned it. ATC is still the worst offender using incomplete call signs. ATC is still the worst offender not answering or acknowledging calls to them. All crews still cannot relax and take anything for granted. If anything is incomplete or unclr or in anyway the slightest in doubt. Do not proceed until it's clarified even if they ignore your calls. After all these years I thought I knew that, but you can get too comfortable after awhile.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLC INADVERTENTLY STARTED DSCNT ON AN ILS APCH PREMATURELY DUE TO MISINTERP OF SIMILAR SOUNDING CALL SIGNS.
Narrative: CLRED FOR ILS APCH TO RWY 11R AT 5000 FT. STARTED DSCNT ON THE GS AND AT ABOUT 4000 FT LOST THE GS SIGNAL. COPLT CALLED APCH CTL AND RPTED LOSS OF GS. I THOUGHT I HEARD CLRED TO 3000 FT. WE DISCOVERED AFTER DSNDING BELOW THE STEP DOWN ALT TO WAYZA (4000 FT) THAT APCH CTL NEVER RESPONDED TO US. (THERE APPARENTLY WAS ANOTHER CARRIER IN THE AREA WITH A SIMILAR CALL SIGN). AT THAT POINT WE WERE VMC AND REMAINED AT 3000 FT UNTIL NEAR KINNS. BY THEN THE GS HAD BEEN RESTORED AND WE REINTERCEPTED THE GS FOR AN UNEVENTFUL VISUAL ILS APCH AND LNDG. IF MSP APCH CTL NOTICED OUR DSCNT BELOW 4000 FT BEFORE WAYZA THEY NEVER MENTIONED IT. ATC IS STILL THE WORST OFFENDER USING INCOMPLETE CALL SIGNS. ATC IS STILL THE WORST OFFENDER NOT ANSWERING OR ACKNOWLEDGING CALLS TO THEM. ALL CREWS STILL CANNOT RELAX AND TAKE ANYTHING FOR GRANTED. IF ANYTHING IS INCOMPLETE OR UNCLR OR IN ANYWAY THE SLIGHTEST IN DOUBT. DO NOT PROCEED UNTIL IT'S CLARIFIED EVEN IF THEY IGNORE YOUR CALLS. AFTER ALL THESE YEARS I THOUGHT I KNEW THAT, BUT YOU CAN GET TOO COMFORTABLE AFTER AWHILE.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.