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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 300441 |
Time | |
Date | 199503 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : mia |
State Reference | FL |
Altitude | agl single value : 500 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Night |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : mia tower : fyv |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | descent : approach landing other |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | MD-11 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach landing : go around |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 9800 flight time type : 4000 |
ASRS Report | 300441 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : atp pilot : commercial |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe conflict : ground less severe other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : unable other |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 2000 vertical : 500 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error other |
Narrative:
WX conditions were ceiling and visibility unlimited, visual approachs in progress with traffic in east flow. (Takeoff and landing runway 9L&right, runway 12.) our aircraft, an far 121 turboprop, was told by ATC that we were #2 for runway 9L, following a company aircraft of same type. We had the other aircraft in sight and reported same to ATC. ATC cleared our aircraft for visual approach, #2, to follow company. At that time we took over our own navigation and separation in order to safely follow the company (same aircraft type). About 8 NM from airport, radar controller advised us to reduce speed to final approach speed as we were indicating 40 KTS faster than company. We complied with ATC instructions, despite the fact that we had in the cockpit a total of 20000 hours flight time, with immense experience in this type of flight activity. At this time we were handed off to local control. As we predicted, company ahead of us pulled away as we flew final approach at minimum approach speed. Aircraft cleared the runway when we were approximately 500 ft AGL. Local control requested that we keep up our speed and plan minimum time on runway as an md-11 was close in behind us, and gaining as we had been quite slow for 8 NM. We complied with local request by using aggressive reversing thrust and aggressive braking, more so than should normally be used considering passenger comfort and aircraft wear and tear. Tower instructed md-11 to go around, despite our speedy exit. Closeness of spacing is indicated by the fact that the go around aircraft was already passed our position by the time we turned off the runway. The moral: pilots know how to fly, they know their airports and they know their airplanes. If ATC gives us a visual approach to follow traffic, let us do it -- don't give us limiting factors such as reduce to final approach speed. If we have the traffic, then it's our responsibility. We know this when we call traffic in sight. We can plan on flying an approach where nobody goes around. If ATC wants to do that, then give us standard IFR separation. Again, let us pilots fly the planes.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: RPTR COMPLAINT OF APCH CTLR JUDGEMENT OF TFC SPACING.
Narrative: WX CONDITIONS WERE CEILING AND VISIBILITY UNLIMITED, VISUAL APCHS IN PROGRESS WITH TFC IN E FLOW. (TKOF AND LNDG RWY 9L&R, RWY 12.) OUR ACFT, AN FAR 121 TURBOPROP, WAS TOLD BY ATC THAT WE WERE #2 FOR RWY 9L, FOLLOWING A COMPANY ACFT OF SAME TYPE. WE HAD THE OTHER ACFT IN SIGHT AND RPTED SAME TO ATC. ATC CLRED OUR ACFT FOR VISUAL APCH, #2, TO FOLLOW COMPANY. AT THAT TIME WE TOOK OVER OUR OWN NAV AND SEPARATION IN ORDER TO SAFELY FOLLOW THE COMPANY (SAME ACFT TYPE). ABOUT 8 NM FROM ARPT, RADAR CTLR ADVISED US TO REDUCE SPD TO FINAL APCH SPD AS WE WERE INDICATING 40 KTS FASTER THAN COMPANY. WE COMPLIED WITH ATC INSTRUCTIONS, DESPITE THE FACT THAT WE HAD IN THE COCKPIT A TOTAL OF 20000 HRS FLT TIME, WITH IMMENSE EXPERIENCE IN THIS TYPE OF FLT ACTIVITY. AT THIS TIME WE WERE HANDED OFF TO LCL CTL. AS WE PREDICTED, COMPANY AHEAD OF US PULLED AWAY AS WE FLEW FINAL APCH AT MINIMUM APCH SPD. ACFT CLRED THE RWY WHEN WE WERE APPROX 500 FT AGL. LCL CTL REQUESTED THAT WE KEEP UP OUR SPD AND PLAN MINIMUM TIME ON RWY AS AN MD-11 WAS CLOSE IN BEHIND US, AND GAINING AS WE HAD BEEN QUITE SLOW FOR 8 NM. WE COMPLIED WITH LCL REQUEST BY USING AGGRESSIVE REVERSING THRUST AND AGGRESSIVE BRAKING, MORE SO THAN SHOULD NORMALLY BE USED CONSIDERING PAX COMFORT AND ACFT WEAR AND TEAR. TWR INSTRUCTED MD-11 TO GAR, DESPITE OUR SPEEDY EXIT. CLOSENESS OF SPACING IS INDICATED BY THE FACT THAT THE GAR ACFT WAS ALREADY PASSED OUR POS BY THE TIME WE TURNED OFF THE RWY. THE MORAL: PLTS KNOW HOW TO FLY, THEY KNOW THEIR ARPTS AND THEY KNOW THEIR AIRPLANES. IF ATC GIVES US A VISUAL APCH TO FOLLOW TFC, LET US DO IT -- DON'T GIVE US LIMITING FACTORS SUCH AS REDUCE TO FINAL APCH SPD. IF WE HAVE THE TFC, THEN IT'S OUR RESPONSIBILITY. WE KNOW THIS WHEN WE CALL TFC IN SIGHT. WE CAN PLAN ON FLYING AN APCH WHERE NOBODY GOES AROUND. IF ATC WANTS TO DO THAT, THEN GIVE US STANDARD IFR SEPARATION. AGAIN, LET US PLTS FLY THE PLANES.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.