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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 306700 |
Time | |
Date | 199506 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : bwi |
State Reference | MD |
Altitude | agl bound lower : 0 agl bound upper : 0 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 135 |
Flight Phase | climbout : takeoff ground : holding |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 270 flight time total : 12300 flight time type : 7000 |
ASRS Report | 306700 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 5000 flight time type : 2600 |
ASRS Report | 306946 |
Events | |
Anomaly | incursion : runway non adherence : clearance non adherence : far |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | none taken : unable other |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
After waiting in line for departure on runway 15L in bwi (government execution movement) (5 mins wait) the aircraft on the runway (in hold position) was given takeoff clearance. We were expecting position and hold clearance, but instead given a takeoff clearance. The first officer read back the clearance, we pulled on the runway, did our takeoff checks and started our takeoff roll. Just at V1 the controller advised us that he had only issued a position and hold clearance. On such a short runway (5000 ft) an abort past V1 was out of the question -- although we were not asked to. After safely in the air, my response was that we had received a takeoff clearance. My first officer also responded that he had also read back the clearance. The controller still maintained that he had issued a position and hold. There were no evasive turns or climbs and we were turned over to departure without further discussions or actions. Unless an emergency situation exists at the time, I feel that a controller should wait until you are in the air (or ground and stopped) to have these discussions. This could have led to a dangerous situation had I (or anyone) had tried to stop, or just to have your attention averted in this critical phase of flight. Supplemental information from acn 306946: cleared for departure. I responded with 'cleared for departure ILS.' this was a little bit unusual because you normally get position and hold first. We assumed he wanted to get a few departures out quickly as traffic had begun to backup. Just before liftoff the controller yelled at us that we were only cleared into position and hold. (A stupid and dangerous transmission on his part because if we had aborted, the aircraft would have overran the end of the runway.) the captain appeared to consider an abort so I yelled we're past V1, 'go, go, go.' we lifted off and the captain responded with negative, you cleared us for departure and I also responded with 'I read it back as cleared for departure.'
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: UNAUTH TKOF. TKOF ROLL MADE UPON 'CLRNC FOR DEP' INSTEAD OF 'CLRED FOR TKOF.'
Narrative: AFTER WAITING IN LINE FOR DEP ON RWY 15L IN BWI (GOV EXECUTION MOVEMENT) (5 MINS WAIT) THE ACFT ON THE RWY (IN HOLD POS) WAS GIVEN TKOF CLRNC. WE WERE EXPECTING POS AND HOLD CLRNC, BUT INSTEAD GIVEN A TKOF CLRNC. THE FO READ BACK THE CLRNC, WE PULLED ON THE RWY, DID OUR TKOF CHKS AND STARTED OUR TKOF ROLL. JUST AT V1 THE CTLR ADVISED US THAT HE HAD ONLY ISSUED A POS AND HOLD CLRNC. ON SUCH A SHORT RWY (5000 FT) AN ABORT PAST V1 WAS OUT OF THE QUESTION -- ALTHOUGH WE WERE NOT ASKED TO. AFTER SAFELY IN THE AIR, MY RESPONSE WAS THAT WE HAD RECEIVED A TKOF CLRNC. MY FO ALSO RESPONDED THAT HE HAD ALSO READ BACK THE CLRNC. THE CTLR STILL MAINTAINED THAT HE HAD ISSUED A POS AND HOLD. THERE WERE NO EVASIVE TURNS OR CLBS AND WE WERE TURNED OVER TO DEP WITHOUT FURTHER DISCUSSIONS OR ACTIONS. UNLESS AN EMER SIT EXISTS AT THE TIME, I FEEL THAT A CTLR SHOULD WAIT UNTIL YOU ARE IN THE AIR (OR GND AND STOPPED) TO HAVE THESE DISCUSSIONS. THIS COULD HAVE LED TO A DANGEROUS SIT HAD I (OR ANYONE) HAD TRIED TO STOP, OR JUST TO HAVE YOUR ATTN AVERTED IN THIS CRITICAL PHASE OF FLT. SUPPLEMENTAL INFORMATION FROM ACN 306946: CLRED FOR DEP. I RESPONDED WITH 'CLRED FOR DEP ILS.' THIS WAS A LITTLE BIT UNUSUAL BECAUSE YOU NORMALLY GET POS AND HOLD FIRST. WE ASSUMED HE WANTED TO GET A FEW DEPS OUT QUICKLY AS TFC HAD BEGUN TO BACKUP. JUST BEFORE LIFTOFF THE CTLR YELLED AT US THAT WE WERE ONLY CLRED INTO POS AND HOLD. (A STUPID AND DANGEROUS XMISSION ON HIS PART BECAUSE IF WE HAD ABORTED, THE ACFT WOULD HAVE OVERRAN THE END OF THE RWY.) THE CAPT APPEARED TO CONSIDER AN ABORT SO I YELLED WE'RE PAST V1, 'GO, GO, GO.' WE LIFTED OFF AND THE CAPT RESPONDED WITH NEGATIVE, YOU CLRED US FOR DEP AND I ALSO RESPONDED WITH 'I READ IT BACK AS CLRED FOR DEP.'
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.