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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 436173 |
Time | |
Date | 199905 |
Day | Tue |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : ord.airport |
State Reference | IL |
Altitude | agl single value : 0 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : ord.tower |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | A319 |
Flight Phase | landing : hold short landing : roll |
Route In Use | approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : ord.tower |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | landing : go around |
Route In Use | approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : commercial pilot : flight engineer pilot : instrument pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 240 flight time total : 8000 flight time type : 1000 |
ASRS Report | 436173 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument pilot : commercial pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 150 flight time total : 5000 flight time type : 680 |
ASRS Report | 436378 |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : ground less severe other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance controller : separated traffic |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Airport FAA Flight Crew Human Performance |
Primary Problem | FAA |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : ord.tower |
Airport | lighting : ord.airport markings : ord.airport signage : ord.airport |
Narrative:
Ord was using runways 14L/right and runways 22L/right for landing with lahso's in effect for runways 14L/right. Departures were using runways 22L/27L. Our flight received landing clearance on runway 22R. The clearance did not include hold short instructions. After touchdown, we planned to vacate the runway at taxiway right. Approaching the runway 22R/9L intersection, I noticed the hold short lights flashing (single row of flashing white lights designating the hold short point) and brought the aircraft to a stop prior to the intersection. The first officer queried the tower requesting clearance to cross runway 9L. There was no response and obvious confusion. With a second attempt to receive a crossing clearance beyond the hold short lights, the tower responded with a 'what?' and subsequent instructions for the aircraft landing behind us to go around. Corrective action: leave the flashing hold short lights off when lahso is not in use. (Not in effect for runway 22R.) check ATIS hard copy. Supplemental information from acn 436378: after parking at the gate, we called the tower on the phone. They said any time there are lahso operations at the field, the flashing lahso lights are illuminated at all times on all runways. This seems confusing to me. It seems the purpose of the lahso lights is to alert the pilots the end of the useable runway is at that point. The pilots should not be trained to go through them sometimes and hold short at others. If a plane is instructed to land and hold short, the lights should go on. If no such clearance is given, the lights should stay off. Continuous operation of the lights, regardless of the clearance, seems to be negative training. Callback conversation with reporter acn 436173 revealed the following information: the pilot describes the lighting as alternating red and white lights. The air carrier does not have any descriptive material about this system. When he saw flashing red and white lights ahead of him he stopped more abruptly than normal. On a telephone conversation with the tower later, they indicated that there was only 1 on/off switch for all the lighting. The tower personnel said they did not want to be bothered, or have the responsibility to control individual runway lighting.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACFT CLRED TO LAND ON RWY 22R. LAHSO LIGHTS AT INTXN OF RWY 22R AND RWY 9L WERE FLASHING. CREW STOPPED ON RWY 22R, SHORT OF RWY 9L. FOLLOWING ACFT EXECUTED GAR.
Narrative: ORD WAS USING RWYS 14L/R AND RWYS 22L/R FOR LNDG WITH LAHSO'S IN EFFECT FOR RWYS 14L/R. DEPS WERE USING RWYS 22L/27L. OUR FLT RECEIVED LNDG CLRNC ON RWY 22R. THE CLRNC DID NOT INCLUDE HOLD SHORT INSTRUCTIONS. AFTER TOUCHDOWN, WE PLANNED TO VACATE THE RWY AT TXWY R. APCHING THE RWY 22R/9L INTXN, I NOTICED THE HOLD SHORT LIGHTS FLASHING (SINGLE ROW OF FLASHING WHITE LIGHTS DESIGNATING THE HOLD SHORT POINT) AND BROUGHT THE ACFT TO A STOP PRIOR TO THE INTXN. THE FO QUERIED THE TWR REQUESTING CLRNC TO CROSS RWY 9L. THERE WAS NO RESPONSE AND OBVIOUS CONFUSION. WITH A SECOND ATTEMPT TO RECEIVE A XING CLRNC BEYOND THE HOLD SHORT LIGHTS, THE TWR RESPONDED WITH A 'WHAT?' AND SUBSEQUENT INSTRUCTIONS FOR THE ACFT LNDG BEHIND US TO GO AROUND. CORRECTIVE ACTION: LEAVE THE FLASHING HOLD SHORT LIGHTS OFF WHEN LAHSO IS NOT IN USE. (NOT IN EFFECT FOR RWY 22R.) CHK ATIS HARD COPY. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 436378: AFTER PARKING AT THE GATE, WE CALLED THE TWR ON THE PHONE. THEY SAID ANY TIME THERE ARE LAHSO OPS AT THE FIELD, THE FLASHING LAHSO LIGHTS ARE ILLUMINATED AT ALL TIMES ON ALL RWYS. THIS SEEMS CONFUSING TO ME. IT SEEMS THE PURPOSE OF THE LAHSO LIGHTS IS TO ALERT THE PLTS THE END OF THE USEABLE RWY IS AT THAT POINT. THE PLTS SHOULD NOT BE TRAINED TO GO THROUGH THEM SOMETIMES AND HOLD SHORT AT OTHERS. IF A PLANE IS INSTRUCTED TO LAND AND HOLD SHORT, THE LIGHTS SHOULD GO ON. IF NO SUCH CLRNC IS GIVEN, THE LIGHTS SHOULD STAY OFF. CONTINUOUS OP OF THE LIGHTS, REGARDLESS OF THE CLRNC, SEEMS TO BE NEGATIVE TRAINING. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR ACN 436173 REVEALED THE FOLLOWING INFO: THE PLT DESCRIBES THE LIGHTING AS ALTERNATING RED AND WHITE LIGHTS. THE ACR DOES NOT HAVE ANY DESCRIPTIVE MATERIAL ABOUT THIS SYS. WHEN HE SAW FLASHING RED AND WHITE LIGHTS AHEAD OF HIM HE STOPPED MORE ABRUPTLY THAN NORMAL. ON A TELEPHONE CONVERSATION WITH THE TWR LATER, THEY INDICATED THAT THERE WAS ONLY 1 ON/OFF SWITCH FOR ALL THE LIGHTING. THE TWR PERSONNEL SAID THEY DID NOT WANT TO BE BOTHERED, OR HAVE THE RESPONSIBILITY TO CTL INDIVIDUAL RWY LIGHTING.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.