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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 481745 |
Time | |
Date | 200007 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : jfk.airport |
State Reference | NY |
Altitude | agl single value : 0 |
Environment | |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : jfk.tower |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | MD-80 Super 80 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | other ndb |
Flight Phase | descent : approach landing : roll |
Route In Use | approach : instrument non precision |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : jfk.tower |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B767 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | ils localizer & glide slope : n/s other |
Route In Use | arrival star : n/s |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument pilot : commercial |
ASRS Report | 481745 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew other |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Company FAA Flight Crew Human Performance Airport |
Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
Situations | |
Airport | design : jfk.airport procedure or policy : jfk.airport |
Narrative:
Jfk was landing runways 13L and 22L simultaneously. We landed runway 13L after flying VOR runway 13L (a unique approach) with winds at pattern altitude about 220 degrees and 30 KTS, tailwind shifting to crosswind during turning approach. Upon touchdown we saw an air carrier B767'er short final runway 22L on a collision course. There was no lahso and this situation commits you to landing only, no go around. This same situation happened a few days prior, with low ceilings and same, normal winds. I called the tower and was told this collision course landing (runways 13L and 22L) is common. The tower does what it can to provide separation but is very restr in having any effect as the aircraft are already low, slow, and configuring. They also said approach tries to provide staggering, separation between runways 13L and 22L arrs. This seems to me to be mission impossible. I saw it not work 2 times in 1 month. If 2 jumbo, heavy aircraft went around at the same time, ie, tower calls go around and everyone does, or runway 13L aircraft goes around we have a conflict. Is there a better way? It's a real eye opener if you have not been there.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: AN MDS80 FO EXPRESSED CONCERN ABOUT LAHSO-TYPE OPS AT JFK ON RWYS 13L AND 22L.
Narrative: JFK WAS LNDG RWYS 13L AND 22L SIMULTANEOUSLY. WE LANDED RWY 13L AFTER FLYING VOR RWY 13L (A UNIQUE APCH) WITH WINDS AT PATTERN ALT ABOUT 220 DEGS AND 30 KTS, TAILWIND SHIFTING TO XWIND DURING TURNING APCH. UPON TOUCHDOWN WE SAW AN ACR B767'ER SHORT FINAL RWY 22L ON A COLLISION COURSE. THERE WAS NO LAHSO AND THIS SIT COMMITS YOU TO LNDG ONLY, NO GAR. THIS SAME SIT HAPPENED A FEW DAYS PRIOR, WITH LOW CEILINGS AND SAME, NORMAL WINDS. I CALLED THE TWR AND WAS TOLD THIS COLLISION COURSE LNDG (RWYS 13L AND 22L) IS COMMON. THE TWR DOES WHAT IT CAN TO PROVIDE SEPARATION BUT IS VERY RESTR IN HAVING ANY EFFECT AS THE ACFT ARE ALREADY LOW, SLOW, AND CONFIGURING. THEY ALSO SAID APCH TRIES TO PROVIDE STAGGERING, SEPARATION BTWN RWYS 13L AND 22L ARRS. THIS SEEMS TO ME TO BE MISSION IMPOSSIBLE. I SAW IT NOT WORK 2 TIMES IN 1 MONTH. IF 2 JUMBO, HVY ACFT WENT AROUND AT THE SAME TIME, IE, TWR CALLS GAR AND EVERYONE DOES, OR RWY 13L ACFT GOES AROUND WE HAVE A CONFLICT. IS THERE A BETTER WAY? IT'S A REAL EYE OPENER IF YOU HAVE NOT BEEN THERE.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.