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Attributes | |
ACN | 570949 |
Time | |
Date | 200301 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : las.airport |
State Reference | NV |
Altitude | msl single value : 10000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : l30.tracon |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | B737-700 |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Navigation In Use | other |
Flight Phase | climbout : intermediate altitude |
Route In Use | departure sid : staar 1 |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : l30.tracon |
Make Model Name | Any Unknown or Unlisted Aircraft Manufacturer |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 5000 |
ASRS Report | 570949 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Events | |
Anomaly | conflict : airborne critical non adherence : published procedure |
Independent Detector | aircraft equipment : tcas other controllera other flight crewa other flight crewb |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued advisory controller : issued new clearance flight crew : took evasive action flight crew : took precautionary avoidance action other |
Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Chart Or Publication FAA Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance Airspace Structure |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error |
Narrative:
We were departing on runway 25R in las, planning to fly the staar 1 LNAV departure. Upon contact with departure control, we were instructed to maintain runway heading and climb to FL190. As we proceeded wbound on runway heading, I was watching closely the terrain and mountains as they rapidly approached. However, being VMC daylight, terrain avoidance was not an issue. Although had it not been daylight VMC this would have concerned me also. Assuming that we had been forgotten, we were just about to query the controller, when we were assigned a right turn to 360 degrees. Approximately heading 310 degrees (still in the turn), the controller gave a TA and an immediate left turn back to heading 270 degrees. Just as we reached heading 270 degrees, we received a TA from our TCASII, immediately followed by an RA to climb. I followed the RA instructions and immediately climbed. When I finally saw the aircraft, he was headed straight for us. We managed to climb above the other aircraft as we both passed to each other's left side. Upon arrival in ZZZ, I called the las TRACON, and was told that neither our control sector nor the sector of the other aircraft were in communication at the time of the incident. The LNAV SID/stars concern me because nothing is ever consistent. In our case, we went from LNAV to heading, to being what I think was forgotten (toward terrain), back to LNAV and resume the departure. Had we been in IMC, the terrain, as well as the RA, would have been (in my view) much more serious. I wish navigation frequencys were printed on the departure plates to make operations at night or in the WX more user friendly. Finally, the practice of being on a SID then off the SID then back on or 'fly the arrival except maintain 13000 ft' is ridiculous! How can we fly procedures when ATC can't even keep up with the procedures we're flying? I wish we would use or get rid of them altogether before somebody gets killed!
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: B737-700 DEPARTS ON A SID, THEN GIVEN VECTORS TOWARDS TERRAIN AND TFC. FLC RECEIVES RA ON TCASII AND CLBS ACFT TO AVOID TFC.
Narrative: WE WERE DEPARTING ON RWY 25R IN LAS, PLANNING TO FLY THE STAAR 1 LNAV DEP. UPON CONTACT WITH DEP CTL, WE WERE INSTRUCTED TO MAINTAIN RWY HDG AND CLB TO FL190. AS WE PROCEEDED WBOUND ON RWY HDG, I WAS WATCHING CLOSELY THE TERRAIN AND MOUNTAINS AS THEY RAPIDLY APCHED. HOWEVER, BEING VMC DAYLIGHT, TERRAIN AVOIDANCE WAS NOT AN ISSUE. ALTHOUGH HAD IT NOT BEEN DAYLIGHT VMC THIS WOULD HAVE CONCERNED ME ALSO. ASSUMING THAT WE HAD BEEN FORGOTTEN, WE WERE JUST ABOUT TO QUERY THE CTLR, WHEN WE WERE ASSIGNED A R TURN TO 360 DEGS. APPROX HDG 310 DEGS (STILL IN THE TURN), THE CTLR GAVE A TA AND AN IMMEDIATE L TURN BACK TO HDG 270 DEGS. JUST AS WE REACHED HDG 270 DEGS, WE RECEIVED A TA FROM OUR TCASII, IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWED BY AN RA TO CLB. I FOLLOWED THE RA INSTRUCTIONS AND IMMEDIATELY CLBED. WHEN I FINALLY SAW THE ACFT, HE WAS HEADED STRAIGHT FOR US. WE MANAGED TO CLB ABOVE THE OTHER ACFT AS WE BOTH PASSED TO EACH OTHER'S L SIDE. UPON ARR IN ZZZ, I CALLED THE LAS TRACON, AND WAS TOLD THAT NEITHER OUR CTL SECTOR NOR THE SECTOR OF THE OTHER ACFT WERE IN COM AT THE TIME OF THE INCIDENT. THE LNAV SID/STARS CONCERN ME BECAUSE NOTHING IS EVER CONSISTENT. IN OUR CASE, WE WENT FROM LNAV TO HDG, TO BEING WHAT I THINK WAS FORGOTTEN (TOWARD TERRAIN), BACK TO LNAV AND RESUME THE DEP. HAD WE BEEN IN IMC, THE TERRAIN, AS WELL AS THE RA, WOULD HAVE BEEN (IN MY VIEW) MUCH MORE SERIOUS. I WISH NAV FREQS WERE PRINTED ON THE DEP PLATES TO MAKE OPS AT NIGHT OR IN THE WX MORE USER FRIENDLY. FINALLY, THE PRACTICE OF BEING ON A SID THEN OFF THE SID THEN BACK ON OR 'FLY THE ARR EXCEPT MAINTAIN 13000 FT' IS RIDICULOUS! HOW CAN WE FLY PROCS WHEN ATC CAN'T EVEN KEEP UP WITH THE PROCS WE'RE FLYING? I WISH WE WOULD USE OR GET RID OF THEM ALTOGETHER BEFORE SOMEBODY GETS KILLED!
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.