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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 583759 |
Time | |
Date | 200306 |
Day | Wed |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : lfpg.airport |
State Reference | FO |
Altitude | agl single value : 0 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Dusk |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : lfpg.tower |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Widebody, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
Flight Phase | ground : holding ground other : line up and wait |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Controlling Facilities | tower : lfpg.tower |
Make Model Name | Any Unknown or Unlisted Aircraft Manufacturer |
Flight Phase | descent : approach |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : multi engine pilot : flight engineer pilot : commercial pilot : cfi pilot : atp pilot : instrument |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 75 flight time total : 8800 flight time type : 700 |
ASRS Report | 583759 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Events | |
Anomaly | non adherence : published procedure non adherence : clearance |
Independent Detector | other controllerb other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | none taken : anomaly accepted |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
Narrative:
Approaching runway, switched from ground to local. Local points out traffic on final. First officer mentions traffic appears to be 3 mi out (on TCASII). Local said traffic is 5 mi out. Local says 'line up and wait runway 27L.' while on taxiway Y11, approaching runway, local mentions 'after departing traffic' line up. Stopped on runway about 5 seconds, then cleared to takeoff. First officer notes landing traffic on TCASII is +600 ft and 2 mi out (behind). Advised by local after takeoff that we were not cleared into position, but to do so after landing traffic. We believe no conflict existed, lfpg controller (uses) non-standard ATC phraseology and conditional clrncs (ie, 'after landing traffic -- line up and wait runway'). First officer read back all (perceived) clrncs and was not corrected. No one was rushed or fatigued.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A 'LINE UP AND WAIT' CLRNC IS DISPUTED AT LFPG.
Narrative: APCHING RWY, SWITCHED FROM GND TO LCL. LCL POINTS OUT TFC ON FINAL. FO MENTIONS TFC APPEARS TO BE 3 MI OUT (ON TCASII). LCL SAID TFC IS 5 MI OUT. LCL SAYS 'LINE UP AND WAIT RWY 27L.' WHILE ON TXWY Y11, APCHING RWY, LCL MENTIONS 'AFTER DEPARTING TFC' LINE UP. STOPPED ON RWY ABOUT 5 SECONDS, THEN CLRED TO TKOF. FO NOTES LNDG TFC ON TCASII IS +600 FT AND 2 MI OUT (BEHIND). ADVISED BY LCL AFTER TKOF THAT WE WERE NOT CLRED INTO POS, BUT TO DO SO AFTER LNDG TFC. WE BELIEVE NO CONFLICT EXISTED, LFPG CTLR (USES) NON-STANDARD ATC PHRASEOLOGY AND CONDITIONAL CLRNCS (IE, 'AFTER LNDG TFC -- LINE UP AND WAIT RWY'). FO READ BACK ALL (PERCEIVED) CLRNCS AND WAS NOT CORRECTED. NO ONE WAS RUSHED OR FATIGUED.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.