Narrative:

On approach sbgl, given vectors to join pirai 15 arrival, followed by descent charlie 3 ILS runway 15. Controller stated, 'cleared via arrival terminology' when issuing the clearance as discussed on the arrival plates. The terminology clearly states clearance to descend as published on the arrival. Charlie 3 descent does not connect to the arrival, so as depicted, we started descent to fl 080 and expected radar vectors. We questioned the controller more than once about this. He initially confirmed charlie 3, even sounded a little frustrated that we were questioning him about it. Then several minutes later, re-cleared us via charlie 1 descent, which does connect with the arrival. Problem: the pirai 15 arrival has an 'at or above' altitude of FL080 at pirai/pai VOR. The last fix on the arrival, which is also the first fix on the descent charlie 1 ILS runway 15. However, on the approach plate, the altitude at pai is 12,000 ft. I questioned the controller about this. Actually I came right out and asked him what altitude he wanted us at and his response was, 'I repeat descend via the arrival,' implying we should just read the arrival page and comply. At this point, I believe we were already below 12,000 on the arrival descending to FL080. We discussed this on the flight deck and captain/PF concludes we are legal to continue down to FL080 and join approach at that altitude, so my question is, were we correct to join the descent charlie 1 arrival runway 15 level at FL080 as depicted on the arrival page even though the approach page shows 12,000 ft at position pai? Also, since transition level is by ATC, normally around 5000 ft, do we comply with all the depicted approach altitudes as flight levels until ATC tells us or MSL depicted on approach plate? Coming of this arrival, we are using flight levels, but upon intercepting the approach, all altitudes are depicted as MSL. A NOTAM attached to the flight plan mentions some discrepancies between the approach plate and the arrival plate, but the NOTAM refers to an outdated page. Is this NOTAM still current?

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: B777 FLT CREW EXPRESSED CONFUSION WITH ALT DEPICTION'S ON APCH CHARTS AND CTLR ACTIONS WHILE ON APCH TO SBGL, FO.

Narrative: ON APCH SBGL, GIVEN VECTORS TO JOIN PIRAI 15 ARR, FOLLOWED BY DSCNT CHARLIE 3 ILS RWY 15. CTLR STATED, 'CLEARED VIA ARR TERMINOLOGY' WHEN ISSUING THE CLRNC AS DISCUSSED ON THE ARR PLATES. THE TERMINOLOGY CLEARLY STATES CLRNC TO DSND AS PUBLISHED ON THE ARR. CHARLIE 3 DSCNT DOES NOT CONNECT TO THE ARR, SO AS DEPICTED, WE STARTED DSCNT TO FL 080 AND EXPECTED RADAR VECTORS. WE QUESTIONED THE CTLR MORE THAN ONCE ABOUT THIS. HE INITIALLY CONFIRMED CHARLIE 3, EVEN SOUNDED A LITTLE FRUSTRATED THAT WE WERE QUESTIONING HIM ABOUT IT. THEN SEVERAL MINUTES LATER, RE-CLEARED US VIA CHARLIE 1 DSCNT, WHICH DOES CONNECT WITH THE ARR. PROB: THE PIRAI 15 ARR HAS AN 'AT OR ABOVE' ALT OF FL080 AT PIRAI/PAI VOR. THE LAST FIX ON THE ARR, WHICH IS ALSO THE FIRST FIX ON THE DSCNT CHARLIE 1 ILS RWY 15. HOWEVER, ON THE APCH PLATE, THE ALT AT PAI IS 12,000 FT. I QUESTIONED THE CTLR ABOUT THIS. ACTUALLY I CAME RIGHT OUT AND ASKED HIM WHAT ALT HE WANTED US AT AND HIS RESPONSE WAS, 'I REPEAT DSND VIA THE ARR,' IMPLYING WE SHOULD JUST READ THE ARR PAGE AND COMPLY. AT THIS POINT, I BELIEVE WE WERE ALREADY BELOW 12,000 ON THE ARR DSNDING TO FL080. WE DISCUSSED THIS ON THE FLT DECK AND CAPT/PF CONCLUDES WE ARE LEGAL TO CONTINUE DOWN TO FL080 AND JOIN APCH AT THAT ALT, SO MY QUESTION IS, WERE WE CORRECT TO JOIN THE DSCNT CHARLIE 1 ARR RWY 15 LEVEL AT FL080 AS DEPICTED ON THE ARR PAGE EVEN THOUGH THE APCH PAGE SHOWS 12,000 FT AT POSITION PAI? ALSO, SINCE TRANSITION LEVEL IS BY ATC, NORMALLY AROUND 5000 FT, DO WE COMPLY WITH ALL THE DEPICTED APCH ALTS AS FLT LEVELS UNTIL ATC TELLS US OR MSL DEPICTED ON APCH PLATE? COMING OF THIS ARR, WE ARE USING FLT LEVELS, BUT UPON INTERCEPTING THE APCH, ALL ALTS ARE DEPICTED AS MSL. A NOTAM ATTACHED TO THE FLT PLAN MENTIONS SOME DISCREPANCIES BETWEEN THE APCH PLATE AND THE ARR PLATE, BUT THE NOTAM REFERS TO AN OUTDATED PAGE. IS THIS NOTAM STILL CURRENT?

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.