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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 620406 |
Time | |
Date | 200406 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : zoa.artcc |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 23500 msl bound upper : 41000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zoa.artcc |
Operator | common carrier : charter |
Make Model Name | Gulfstream Jet Undifferentiated or Other Model |
Operating Under FAR Part | Part 135 |
Navigation In Use | other other vortac |
Flight Phase | descent : intermediate altitude |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : charter |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 80 flight time total : 3800 flight time type : 1400 |
ASRS Report | 620406 |
Person 2 | |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Events | |
Anomaly | aircraft equipment problem : less severe altitude deviation : crossing restriction not met altitude deviation : overshoot conflict : airborne less severe |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | flight crew : returned to assigned altitude |
Supplementary | |
Problem Areas | Environmental Factor Aircraft ATC Human Performance |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
Returning to bur on an empty leg, we received a clearance from ZOA to descend from FL410 to FL240, 5 mi north of the fellows VOR. I promptly entered the new restr into the FMS VNAV guidance page and was stunned to see the initial descent rate required was over 6200 FPM! I thought I had to have entered the data incorrectly and did it again with the same result. I then asked the captain (PNF) if he could verify my inputs as I couldn't believe the result. Together, we entered the data a third time and the rate was now approaching 7000 FPM. At this time, ZOA came back on the radio and asked if we would make the restr because it was for traffic. I shouted 'no way' to the captain, but he replied affirmatively to center. He then told me to just use the speed brakes as we did not have any passenger on board. I then proceeded to make a maximum effort descent and had the vsi pegged out at over 6000 FPM. On this aircraft, the vsi is also the TCASII display and I noticed we had an RA fail annunciation. This was due to the high rate of descent. Finally, I approached FL240 and tried to level off, but was unable to do so and actually descended to maybe FL235. Additionally, I think I did not reach assigned altitude until well inside the 5 mi restr. I feel we should not have accepted the descent clearance in the first place, or at a minimum, reported we would be unable to make it once it became apparent the rate of descent would be too high. I don't think ATC should have given the clearance either, as it was unsafe to make such a high rate of descent so that your TCASII system becomes useless.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ALT OVERSHOOT WHEN XING RESTR NOT MADE. RATE OF DSCNT REQUIRED APCHING 7000 FPM 5 NM N OF FLW, CA.
Narrative: RETURNING TO BUR ON AN EMPTY LEG, WE RECEIVED A CLRNC FROM ZOA TO DSND FROM FL410 TO FL240, 5 MI N OF THE FELLOWS VOR. I PROMPTLY ENTERED THE NEW RESTR INTO THE FMS VNAV GUIDANCE PAGE AND WAS STUNNED TO SEE THE INITIAL DSCNT RATE REQUIRED WAS OVER 6200 FPM! I THOUGHT I HAD TO HAVE ENTERED THE DATA INCORRECTLY AND DID IT AGAIN WITH THE SAME RESULT. I THEN ASKED THE CAPT (PNF) IF HE COULD VERIFY MY INPUTS AS I COULDN'T BELIEVE THE RESULT. TOGETHER, WE ENTERED THE DATA A THIRD TIME AND THE RATE WAS NOW APCHING 7000 FPM. AT THIS TIME, ZOA CAME BACK ON THE RADIO AND ASKED IF WE WOULD MAKE THE RESTR BECAUSE IT WAS FOR TFC. I SHOUTED 'NO WAY' TO THE CAPT, BUT HE REPLIED AFFIRMATIVELY TO CTR. HE THEN TOLD ME TO JUST USE THE SPD BRAKES AS WE DID NOT HAVE ANY PAX ON BOARD. I THEN PROCEEDED TO MAKE A MAX EFFORT DSCNT AND HAD THE VSI PEGGED OUT AT OVER 6000 FPM. ON THIS ACFT, THE VSI IS ALSO THE TCASII DISPLAY AND I NOTICED WE HAD AN RA FAIL ANNUNCIATION. THIS WAS DUE TO THE HIGH RATE OF DSCNT. FINALLY, I APCHED FL240 AND TRIED TO LEVEL OFF, BUT WAS UNABLE TO DO SO AND ACTUALLY DSNDED TO MAYBE FL235. ADDITIONALLY, I THINK I DID NOT REACH ASSIGNED ALT UNTIL WELL INSIDE THE 5 MI RESTR. I FEEL WE SHOULD NOT HAVE ACCEPTED THE DSCNT CLRNC IN THE FIRST PLACE, OR AT A MINIMUM, RPTED WE WOULD BE UNABLE TO MAKE IT ONCE IT BECAME APPARENT THE RATE OF DSCNT WOULD BE TOO HIGH. I DON'T THINK ATC SHOULD HAVE GIVEN THE CLRNC EITHER, AS IT WAS UNSAFE TO MAKE SUCH A HIGH RATE OF DSCNT SO THAT YOUR TCASII SYS BECOMES USELESS.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.