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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 103000 |
Time | |
Date | 198901 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : iah |
State Reference | TX |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 12000 msl bound upper : 24000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | artcc : zhu tower : mdw |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Widebody, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | descent other |
Route In Use | arrival star : star enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : flight engineer pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 90 flight time total : 3500 flight time type : 90 |
ASRS Report | 103000 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 30000 flight time type : 3000 |
ASRS Report | 102808 |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : excursion from assigned altitude other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation other |
Narrative:
Were cleared direct cll, descend to 24000'. Then were cleared to 24000' direct hogie. Out of 26000' I asked ATC, 'are we to stop at 24000', or are we cleared direct hogie and cleared for the cougar 4 arrival to iah?' ATC answered back, 'you are cleared direct hogie and cleared for the cougar 4 arrival.' 20 mi out of hogie and at 12000' ATC advised us that we were not ever cleared out of 24000'. No conflict occurred. There was a communication misunderstanding about whether we were cleared to descend below 24000' or not. Landed west/O any further problems. What must be remembered here is that on a profile you are expected to, on an arrival you are expected to expect. Flying back and forth to airports that have a profile at one and an arrival at another one must be careful. Supplemental information from acn 102808: ATC cleared us to descend and maintain FL240 direct cll. Before things got too busy I made a visit to lav. On my return to cockpit I noticed 10000' on altitude alert system and asked, 'cleared to 10000?' first officer responded, 'yes, and direct hogie.' all was normal. I had no reason to question a normal operation. At 12000' ZHU advised that our last assigned altitude was FL240. Imagine my surprise. If we are at 12000' on descent, what is our assigned altitude now? ATC advised continue to and maintain 10000', direct hogie, contact iah approach. At the gate iah, I asked how this happened. I was told a long story about miscom and poor choice of words from aircraft and ATC. Had proper communication and phraseology been used, this would have never happened. Supplemental information from acn 102812: during descent controller cleared aircraft to hogie intersection via cougar 4 arrival. Pilot acknowledged. Approaching FL240 pilot asked the controller: 'do you want us to stop at FL240 or continue?' controller replied, 'continue on cougar 4 arrival.'
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR WDB ALT EXCURSION. ARTCC RADAR CTLR POOR PHRASEOLOGY.
Narrative: WERE CLRED DIRECT CLL, DSND TO 24000'. THEN WERE CLRED TO 24000' DIRECT HOGIE. OUT OF 26000' I ASKED ATC, 'ARE WE TO STOP AT 24000', OR ARE WE CLRED DIRECT HOGIE AND CLRED FOR THE COUGAR 4 ARR TO IAH?' ATC ANSWERED BACK, 'YOU ARE CLRED DIRECT HOGIE AND CLRED FOR THE COUGAR 4 ARR.' 20 MI OUT OF HOGIE AND AT 12000' ATC ADVISED US THAT WE WERE NOT EVER CLRED OUT OF 24000'. NO CONFLICT OCCURRED. THERE WAS A COM MISUNDERSTANDING ABOUT WHETHER WE WERE CLRED TO DSND BELOW 24000' OR NOT. LANDED W/O ANY FURTHER PROBS. WHAT MUST BE REMEMBERED HERE IS THAT ON A PROFILE YOU ARE EXPECTED TO, ON AN ARR YOU ARE EXPECTED TO EXPECT. FLYING BACK AND FORTH TO ARPTS THAT HAVE A PROFILE AT ONE AND AN ARR AT ANOTHER ONE MUST BE CAREFUL. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 102808: ATC CLRED US TO DSND AND MAINTAIN FL240 DIRECT CLL. BEFORE THINGS GOT TOO BUSY I MADE A VISIT TO LAV. ON MY RETURN TO COCKPIT I NOTICED 10000' ON ALT ALERT SYS AND ASKED, 'CLRED TO 10000?' F/O RESPONDED, 'YES, AND DIRECT HOGIE.' ALL WAS NORMAL. I HAD NO REASON TO QUESTION A NORMAL OPERATION. AT 12000' ZHU ADVISED THAT OUR LAST ASSIGNED ALT WAS FL240. IMAGINE MY SURPRISE. IF WE ARE AT 12000' ON DSCNT, WHAT IS OUR ASSIGNED ALT NOW? ATC ADVISED CONTINUE TO AND MAINTAIN 10000', DIRECT HOGIE, CONTACT IAH APCH. AT THE GATE IAH, I ASKED HOW THIS HAPPENED. I WAS TOLD A LONG STORY ABOUT MISCOM AND POOR CHOICE OF WORDS FROM ACFT AND ATC. HAD PROPER COM AND PHRASEOLOGY BEEN USED, THIS WOULD HAVE NEVER HAPPENED. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 102812: DURING DSCNT CTLR CLRED ACFT TO HOGIE INTXN VIA COUGAR 4 ARR. PLT ACKNOWLEDGED. APCHING FL240 PLT ASKED THE CTLR: 'DO YOU WANT US TO STOP AT FL240 OR CONTINUE?' CTLR REPLIED, 'CONTINUE ON COUGAR 4 ARR.'
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.