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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 119647 |
Time | |
Date | 198908 |
Day | Fri |
Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | atc facility : lax |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 700 msl bound upper : 700 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | Mixed |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : lax |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | descent : approach descent other landing : go around |
Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi pilot : flight engineer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 8900 flight time type : 800 |
ASRS Report | 119647 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp |
Events | |
Anomaly | other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | other other |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | other |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
Flying into lax from the north on the fim arrival we were assigned 24R visual approach over smo VOR. Turning a right base approximately 6 mi from the airport we were recleared for a visual approach to runway 25R. We were told to follow an aircraft, which we had in sight, but we never reported the runway in sight. The visibility at the time was reported at 4 mi in haze. As we turned final we lost our traffic and the visibility facing west was reduced to approximately 1 1/2 mi. We told the controller that we had lost our traffic so he told us to intercept localizer for 25R. The captain, pne, tried to identify ILS for 25R but was getting an identify for 25L. He advised the controller of this and that we still did not have the runway in sight. We finally picked up the runway approximately 1 1/2 mi from the end. The controller instructed us however to make a missed approach. I fly into lax with quite a bit of frequency. It always seems that when approaching the airport from the north, the controllers will give at least 2, sometimes 3, runway changes. This can be confusing for someone that is familiar with lax let alone someone that is not. Also visual apches are used much too liberally at lax. When it's hazy, as it usually is, and your turning final, the visibility is further reduced in the afternoon sun. The 4 parallel runways that are also close together can also add to the confusion. There, of course, was no violation in this instance, but this scenario occurs much too often and should be addressed.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLT CREW ON VISUAL APCH TO LAX RWY DID NOT SEE RWY UNTIL 1 PT 5 MILES OUT. MADE A GO AROUND.
Narrative: FLYING INTO LAX FROM THE N ON THE FIM ARR WE WERE ASSIGNED 24R VISUAL APCH OVER SMO VOR. TURNING A RIGHT BASE APPROX 6 MI FROM THE ARPT WE WERE RECLEARED FOR A VISUAL APCH TO RWY 25R. WE WERE TOLD TO FOLLOW AN ACFT, WHICH WE HAD IN SIGHT, BUT WE NEVER REPORTED THE RWY IN SIGHT. THE VISIBILITY AT THE TIME WAS REPORTED AT 4 MI IN HAZE. AS WE TURNED FINAL WE LOST OUR TFC AND THE VISIBILITY FACING W WAS REDUCED TO APPROX 1 1/2 MI. WE TOLD THE CTLR THAT WE HAD LOST OUR TFC SO HE TOLD US TO INTERCEPT LOC FOR 25R. THE CAPT, PNE, TRIED TO IDENTIFY ILS FOR 25R BUT WAS GETTING AN IDENT FOR 25L. HE ADVISED THE CTLR OF THIS AND THAT WE STILL DID NOT HAVE THE RWY IN SIGHT. WE FINALLY PICKED UP THE RWY APPROX 1 1/2 MI FROM THE END. THE CTLR INSTRUCTED US HOWEVER TO MAKE A MISSED APCH. I FLY INTO LAX WITH QUITE A BIT OF FREQUENCY. IT ALWAYS SEEMS THAT WHEN APCHING THE ARPT FROM THE N, THE CTLRS WILL GIVE AT LEAST 2, SOMETIMES 3, RWY CHANGES. THIS CAN BE CONFUSING FOR SOMEONE THAT IS FAMILIAR WITH LAX LET ALONE SOMEONE THAT IS NOT. ALSO VISUAL APCHES ARE USED MUCH TOO LIBERALLY AT LAX. WHEN IT'S HAZY, AS IT USUALLY IS, AND YOUR TURNING FINAL, THE VISIBILITY IS FURTHER REDUCED IN THE AFTERNOON SUN. THE 4 PARALLEL RWYS THAT ARE ALSO CLOSE TOGETHER CAN ALSO ADD TO THE CONFUSION. THERE, OF COURSE, WAS NO VIOLATION IN THIS INSTANCE, BUT THIS SCENARIO OCCURS MUCH TOO OFTEN AND SHOULD BE ADDRESSED.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.