37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
|
Attributes | |
ACN | 242897 |
Time | |
Date | 199305 |
Day | Mon |
Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : ewr |
State Reference | NJ |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 2500 msl bound upper : 5000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : ewr |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | climbout : intermediate altitude climbout : takeoff |
Route In Use | departure other departure sid : sid enroute : on vectors |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : instrument pilot : atp pilot : commercial pilot : flight engineer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 5000 flight time type : 800 |
ASRS Report | 242897 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi pilot : flight engineer |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 10000 flight time type : 210 |
ASRS Report | 242744 |
Events | |
Anomaly | altitude deviation : overshoot non adherence : clearance non adherence : published procedure other anomaly other |
Independent Detector | other controllera |
Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
Consequence | Other |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Chart Or Publication |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Situations | |
ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Publication | Unspecified |
Narrative:
We received our pre-departure clearance just prior to pushback. The traffic load at newark was low. We were able to taxi and takeoff with no delays. During taxi and takeoff we were not given any altitude clrncs. The ATIS advised us that the newark 4 SID noise abatement evaluation was in effect. Upon reaching 5000 ft on departure, departure control advised us 'it's 2500 ft today.' at first, neither the captain nor I understood what the controller was referring to. We were then handed off to ZNY. While I continued to fly, the captain and I re-referred to the pre-departure clearance and noted the M2500! I feel this is potentially a very dangerous practice. M2500 is a nonstandard format for publishing altitude restrictions. Note that both the SID and the noise abatement SID have maintain 5000 ft in bold print and the word 'maintain' is spelled out completely. Had the conditions been IMC and on a normal day my writing this report might not be reality. We all agree that standard terminology is a must in the aviation community. The fact that departure control allowed us to level off at 5000 ft and acknowledged our chkin 'passing 500 ft for 5000 ft,' leads me to believe that he too was also unclr as to the correct level off altitude on the SID. Our departure runway was 22R.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ALT DEV AND MORE PREDEP CLRNC WOES. ALT OVERSHOT IN A NON ADHERENCE TO ATC CLRNC INSTRUCTION.
Narrative: WE RECEIVED OUR PRE-DEP CLRNC JUST PRIOR TO PUSHBACK. THE TFC LOAD AT NEWARK WAS LOW. WE WERE ABLE TO TAXI AND TKOF WITH NO DELAYS. DURING TAXI AND TKOF WE WERE NOT GIVEN ANY ALT CLRNCS. THE ATIS ADVISED US THAT THE NEWARK 4 SID NOISE ABATEMENT EVALUATION WAS IN EFFECT. UPON REACHING 5000 FT ON DEP, DEP CTL ADVISED US 'IT'S 2500 FT TODAY.' AT FIRST, NEITHER THE CAPT NOR I UNDERSTOOD WHAT THE CTLR WAS REFERRING TO. WE WERE THEN HANDED OFF TO ZNY. WHILE I CONTINUED TO FLY, THE CAPT AND I RE-REFERRED TO THE PRE-DEP CLRNC AND NOTED THE M2500! I FEEL THIS IS POTENTIALLY A VERY DANGEROUS PRACTICE. M2500 IS A NONSTANDARD FORMAT FOR PUBLISHING ALT RESTRICTIONS. NOTE THAT BOTH THE SID AND THE NOISE ABATEMENT SID HAVE MAINTAIN 5000 FT IN BOLD PRINT AND THE WORD 'MAINTAIN' IS SPELLED OUT COMPLETELY. HAD THE CONDITIONS BEEN IMC AND ON A NORMAL DAY MY WRITING THIS RPT MIGHT NOT BE REALITY. WE ALL AGREE THAT STANDARD TERMINOLOGY IS A MUST IN THE AVIATION COMMUNITY. THE FACT THAT DEP CTL ALLOWED US TO LEVEL OFF AT 5000 FT AND ACKNOWLEDGED OUR CHKIN 'PASSING 500 FT FOR 5000 FT,' LEADS ME TO BELIEVE THAT HE TOO WAS ALSO UNCLR AS TO THE CORRECT LEVEL OFF ALT ON THE SID. OUR DEP RWY WAS 22R.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.