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|
Attributes | |
ACN | 185373 |
Time | |
Date | 199108 |
Day | Sun |
Local Time Of Day | 1801 To 2400 |
Place | |
Locale Reference | airport : lax |
State Reference | CA |
Altitude | msl bound lower : 3000 msl bound upper : 3000 |
Environment | |
Flight Conditions | VMC |
Light | Daylight |
Aircraft 1 | |
Controlling Facilities | tracon : lax |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Widebody, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other |
Flight Phase | cruise other descent other |
Route In Use | approach : straight in approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Aircraft 2 | |
Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
Make Model Name | Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng |
Navigation In Use | Other Other |
Flight Phase | cruise other descent : approach descent other |
Route In Use | approach : visual |
Flight Plan | IFR |
Person 1 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
Qualification | pilot : commercial pilot : instrument pilot : flight engineer pilot : atp |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 225 flight time total : 15000 flight time type : 5200 |
ASRS Report | 185373 |
Person 2 | |
Affiliation | company : air carrier |
Function | flight crew : first officer |
Qualification | pilot : flight engineer pilot : instrument pilot : commercial |
Experience | flight time last 90 days : 220 flight time total : 7000 flight time type : 2500 |
ASRS Report | 185382 |
Events | |
Anomaly | inflight encounter other non adherence : clearance other spatial deviation |
Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance flight crew : returned to intended course or assigned course other |
Consequence | Other |
Miss Distance | horizontal : 2000 vertical : 250 |
Supplementary | |
Primary Problem | Flight Crew Human Performance |
Air Traffic Incident | Pilot Deviation |
Narrative:
On ILS approach to 25L at lax we were advised that an large transport at 2 O'clock and 4 mi was on a right base for a visual to the parallel runway 25R. We advised approach that we had the traffic, and were cleared to continue approach to 25L and told to contact tower at OM. The large transport then overshot both 25R and 25L and from a position south of us turned back to north in front of us to reacquire 25R centerline. Since we were overtaking the large transport that was now crossing our flight path, we maneuvered to maintain clearance and separation. The other aircraft was approximately 2000 ft ahead and approximately 250-400 ft below. The tower then called the large transport and cleared him to land on 25L since he was closer to that runway and reclred us to 25R. The pilot then advised tower that he did not have either runway in sight and proceeded to the north towards 25R. We once again maneuvered to our left to line up with 25L and were cleared to land on that runway. The large transport landed on 25R. While maneuvering behind and above the large transport I considered a go around but did not make one since we had the other aircraft in sight at all times and was fearful that we would lose sight of him in the go around, and since he stated he had lost view of the runways he might also go around and pitch up into our flight path. In future at lax, approach control should possibly not be giving these visual approachs to 25R which require a sharp turn in, while other aircraft are flying ILS approachs to 25L, since the runways are so close together that any overshoot will cause this type of incident.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: CLOSE PROX ACR WDB ON STRAIGHT IN TO RWY 25L AT LAX AND ACR LGT ON VISUAL TO RWY 25R.
Narrative: ON ILS APCH TO 25L AT LAX WE WERE ADVISED THAT AN LGT AT 2 O'CLOCK AND 4 MI WAS ON A R BASE FOR A VISUAL TO THE PARALLEL RWY 25R. WE ADVISED APCH THAT WE HAD THE TFC, AND WERE CLRED TO CONTINUE APCH TO 25L AND TOLD TO CONTACT TWR AT OM. THE LGT THEN OVERSHOT BOTH 25R AND 25L AND FROM A POS S OF US TURNED BACK TO N IN FRONT OF US TO REACQUIRE 25R CENTERLINE. SINCE WE WERE OVERTAKING THE LGT THAT WAS NOW XING OUR FLT PATH, WE MANEUVERED TO MAINTAIN CLRNC AND SEPARATION. THE OTHER ACFT WAS APPROX 2000 FT AHEAD AND APPROX 250-400 FT BELOW. THE TWR THEN CALLED THE LGT AND CLRED HIM TO LAND ON 25L SINCE HE WAS CLOSER TO THAT RWY AND RECLRED US TO 25R. THE PLT THEN ADVISED TWR THAT HE DID NOT HAVE EITHER RWY IN SIGHT AND PROCEEDED TO THE N TOWARDS 25R. WE ONCE AGAIN MANEUVERED TO OUR L TO LINE UP WITH 25L AND WERE CLRED TO LAND ON THAT RWY. THE LGT LANDED ON 25R. WHILE MANEUVERING BEHIND AND ABOVE THE LGT I CONSIDERED A GAR BUT DID NOT MAKE ONE SINCE WE HAD THE OTHER ACFT IN SIGHT AT ALL TIMES AND WAS FEARFUL THAT WE WOULD LOSE SIGHT OF HIM IN THE GAR, AND SINCE HE STATED HE HAD LOST VIEW OF THE RWYS HE MIGHT ALSO GAR AND PITCH UP INTO OUR FLT PATH. IN FUTURE AT LAX, APCH CTL SHOULD POSSIBLY NOT BE GIVING THESE VISUAL APCHS TO 25R WHICH REQUIRE A SHARP TURN IN, WHILE OTHER ACFT ARE FLYING ILS APCHS TO 25L, SINCE THE RWYS ARE SO CLOSE TOGETHER THAT ANY OVERSHOOT WILL CAUSE THIS TYPE OF INCIDENT.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.